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 Civil Internment Camp No 2?

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carolathfc
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Number of posts : 3
Registration date : 2011-03-09

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime9/3/2011, 16:26

Am trying to find out the location of the Civil Internment Camp No 2 in the British Sector in Germany. My grandad was posted there at the end of 1945, and so far I've drawn a blank in finding where it was. Many thanks for any clues.
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JPW
Let Gen
Let Gen


Number of posts : 1098
Age : 78
Localisation : Berkshire
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime9/3/2011, 17:12

Carol

You could try the National Archives at Kew

Would offer to help but a recent visit shows there are over 12 thousand separate files dealing with the early days of British Forces in Germany

JPW
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Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime9/3/2011, 17:47

There was a CIC 2 in Bonn

--------------------------

C.I.E. 2


Located in British Zone
No 2 CIC"
On card dated 23.7.46 from Wilhelmshaven, addressed to "2. Civil Internment Camp / Via Bonn"

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carolathfc
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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime20/3/2011, 10:42

Hi guys

Success! The CIC 2 War Diary for 1945 at Kew National Archives indicates that CIC 2 was Sandbostel, northern Germany.
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JPW
Let Gen
Let Gen


Number of posts : 1098
Age : 78
Localisation : Berkshire
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime20/3/2011, 13:36

Glad you were successful in your quest, interestingly there is a vague link with another ongoing quest elsewhere on this site
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alan8376
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Number of posts : 469
Age : 71
Localisation : Norfolk, UK
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Carlisle AAS, Aden, Hildesheim, Bordon, Fallingbostel, Dover, NI Tours, Osnabruck, Herford, Muenster, UN Nicosia, SBA Dhekellia Cyprus x2, Waterbeach, Civi Street 1988. Retired from VOSA 2007.
Registration date : 2009-07-28

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime20/3/2011, 14:43

Here is an interesting site.

http://www.dpcamps.org/slaveCampsR-S.html

Scroll down to SANDBOSTEL

Althought the term Civil Internment Camp'is used within the context of this thread. I would also use the term 'DP Camp' (Displaced Persons) as well when doing searches. It seems to be the more commonly used name.

Alan
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Pborn3
WOI
WOI
Pborn3

Number of posts : 134
Age : 72
Localisation : Porta Westfalica
Cap Badge : RA
Places Served : Oswestry, Paderborn, Barnard Castle, Catterick, NI, Bristol, Cyprus, Munsterlager, NI,Sennelager , NI , Rge Control/STC Sennelager/ GSU Sennelager as Civvy
Registration date : 2013-09-23

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime17/3/2014, 15:48

British – Civil Internment Centre(s) under British Military Admin: Estab was 5 Offrs and 82 - 92 OR. There would be increments (Guards, Outer security, Med Staffs, Dvrs etc) from nearby or garrison units. Staumühle Lager had a Searchlight Battery and the Resident Inf Unit from Schl. Neuhaus as QRF. There was political uncertainty and friction between the military occupiers and the concept of the Control Commission for Germany becoming the Standing power for the BR sector so it was 15 Apr 46 before the Home Office supplied appropriate Prison Staffs to the UK Foreign Office who ran the Internment Camps through CCG instead of the military.


CIC No1 at Neumünster
CIC No 2 at Sandbostel near Bremervorde (formerly PoW Camp Stalag Xb
CIC No 3 at Fallingbostel (formerly Stalag XI b)
CIC No 4 at Recklinghausen
CIC No 5 at Staumühler between Sennelager and Hövelhof (had been numbered No. 92 by US Forces up to May 45) (formerly SS Reinforcement Barracks) see WO171/ 8302 at PRO Kew for War Diary
CIC No 6 at Neuengamme near Hamburg (formerly Konzentrations Camp (KZ) Neuengamme.
CIC No 7 from Sep 46 at Eselsheide (Stukenbrock-Senne) [had been at Hemer "Camp Roosevelt" up to Sep 46] ( formerly Stalag 326 VIK - Rusian PoW)
CIC No 8 at Westertimke (30 km NE of Bremen) (had been Marlag for RN and Milag for Interned Merch Navy pers) see http://www.usmm.org/milag.html
CIC No 9 at Esterwegen near Papenburg in Emsland.
101 Prison Camp Esterwegen after Jul 46
No 1 Civil Internment Settlement Adelheide nr Delmenhorst (May 47 - Aug 48)
No 74 Combined Services Interrogation Centre Bad Nenndorf (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bad_Nenndorf_interrogation_centre
or
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2006/apr/03/uk.freedomofinformation)



CCG (BE) – Control Commission for Germany (British Element) at Lübbecke (1st Leader: Sir Hugh Brian Robertson)

COGA – Control Office for Germany & Austria (Leader: John Burns Hynd MP followed by Lord Pakenham 1947)) FO 1032/2228

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Pborn4
Maj
Maj
Pborn4

Number of posts : 243
Age : 72
Localisation : Between Hannover and Herford, off all main routes
Cap Badge : Not even a reservist now - have been Pborn3
Places Served : Oswestry 1965, Paderborn to 1971, NE Dist, Munsterlager from 1974, Sennelager (1976 to 2012)
Registration date : 2016-12-16

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: CIC No 6   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime14/12/2018, 14:24

Pborn3 wrote:
British – Civil Internment Centre(s)  under British Military Admin:  Estab was 5 Offrs and 82  - 92 OR.  There would be increments (Guards, Outer security, Med Staffs, Dvrs etc) from nearby or garrison units.  Staumühle Lager had a Searchlight Battery and the Resident Inf Unit from Schl. Neuhaus as QRF.   There was political uncertainty and friction between the military occupiers and the concept of the Control Commission for Germany becoming the Standing power for the BR sector so it was 15 Apr 46 before the Home Office supplied appropriate Prison Staffs to the UK Foreign Office who ran the Internment Camps through CCG instead of the military.


CIC No1 at Neumünster
CIC No 2  at Sandbostel  near Bremervorde  (formerly PoW Camp Stalag Xb
CIC No 3  at Fallingbostel  (formerly Stalag XI b)
CIC No 4  at Recklinghausen
CIC No 5  at Staumühler between Sennelager and Hövelhof (had been numbered  No. 92 by US Forces up to May 45)  (formerly SS Reinforcement Barracks) see WO171/ 8302 at PRO Kew for War Diary
CIC No 6  at Neuengamme near Hamburg (formerly Konzentrations Camp (KZ) Neuengamme) FO1032/2232 at Kew.
CIC No 7  from Sep 46 at Eselsheide (Stukenbrock-Senne) [had been at Hemer "Camp Roosevelt" up to Sep  46]  ( formerly Stalag 326 VIK  - Rusian PoW)
CIC No 8 at Westertimke (30 km NE of Bremen)  (had been Marlag for RN  and Milag for Interned Merch Navy pers)  see http://www.usmm.org/milag.html
CIC No 9 at Esterwegen near Papenburg in Emsland.
101  Prison Camp Esterwegen after Jul 46
No 1 Civil Internment Settlement Adelheide nr Delmenhorst (May 47 - Aug 48)
No 74  Combined Services Interrogation Centre Bad Nenndorf  (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bad_Nenndorf_interrogation_centre
or
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2006/apr/03/uk.freedomofinformation)



CCG (BE) – Control Commission for Germany (British Element) at Lübbecke (1st Leader: Sir Hugh Brian Robertson)

COGA – Control Office for Germany & Austria (Leader: John Burns Hynd MP  followed by Lord Pakenham 1947)) FO 1032/2228  

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RD1988
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Number of posts : 8
Registration date : 2019-04-27

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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime27/4/2019, 20:41

Hi guys, I am searching for interrogation files from 032 Civilian Interrogation Centre at Gartenstrasse, Iserlohn. Does anyone know the reference numbers for this centre at the National Archives?
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steve
LE Maj
LE Maj
steve

Number of posts : 840
Age : 70
Localisation : near Cuxhaven
Cap Badge : Royal Signals + Royal Engineers
Places Served : Verden-Aller + Willich + Iserlohn + Hameln
Registration date : 2010-02-14

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 14:22

Welcome

Have checked the National Archives search engine and 032 Civilian Interrogation Centre is not listed, WO 171/7985 is the reference for 328 Military Government Detachment Iserlohn, this could be of help, can confirm the large building on the Baarstrasse was the “Unterkunft der Schupo” a police HQ, in the 1980s I lived across the road in what was requisitioned as “S Mess” in 1945/6, this police HQ appears on the town plan I have for that era but not later.

Best of luck with your research
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RD1988
LCpl
LCpl


Number of posts : 8
Registration date : 2019-04-27

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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 14:26

Thanks for your reply, Steve. I have the case number for the person I am searching for, and the date the report on the person was written. Do you think it is worth contacting the archives with that information?
Kind regards,
Rich
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RD1988
LCpl
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Number of posts : 8
Registration date : 2019-04-27

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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 14:33

Thanks for your reply, Steve. I have the case number for the person I am searching for, and the date the report on the person was written. Do you think it is worth contacting the archives with that information?
Kind regards,
Rich
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alan8376
Col
Col


Number of posts : 469
Age : 71
Localisation : Norfolk, UK
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Carlisle AAS, Aden, Hildesheim, Bordon, Fallingbostel, Dover, NI Tours, Osnabruck, Herford, Muenster, UN Nicosia, SBA Dhekellia Cyprus x2, Waterbeach, Civi Street 1988. Retired from VOSA 2007.
Registration date : 2009-07-28

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 14:52

Out of interest. What time frame is your case you are searching for?

Alan
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RD1988
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Number of posts : 8
Registration date : 2019-04-27

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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 14:53

Hi Steve, the date of the report is 6th Sept 1945.
Best,
Rich
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alan8376
Col
Col


Number of posts : 469
Age : 71
Localisation : Norfolk, UK
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Carlisle AAS, Aden, Hildesheim, Bordon, Fallingbostel, Dover, NI Tours, Osnabruck, Herford, Muenster, UN Nicosia, SBA Dhekellia Cyprus x2, Waterbeach, Civi Street 1988. Retired from VOSA 2007.
Registration date : 2009-07-28

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 15:03

Rich,  I have lots of 'Black Market' files Mil/Civ Courts from Hamburg during the early years, which I have from the TNA at Kew.

I know the files came from the Forein Office. I have the File ref/location numbers on the file covers.

All the hundreds of court cases listed were committed by civillians German and Forein. Each had a ref No/ listed by surname and punishment handed out.

Can I deduce you maybe looking for a case number involving a military person?

Alan
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RD1988
LCpl
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Number of posts : 8
Registration date : 2019-04-27

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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 15:07

Dear Alan,
Thanks for your reply. I am indeed researching a person from the German military. He was interrogated at 032 on 6th sept 1945 whilst in British custody. Frustratingly I only have the last page in the file, which features the case number.

Best, Rich
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alan8376
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Col


Number of posts : 469
Age : 71
Localisation : Norfolk, UK
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Carlisle AAS, Aden, Hildesheim, Bordon, Fallingbostel, Dover, NI Tours, Osnabruck, Herford, Muenster, UN Nicosia, SBA Dhekellia Cyprus x2, Waterbeach, Civi Street 1988. Retired from VOSA 2007.
Registration date : 2009-07-28

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 15:21

Rich, My lists indicate as being only civillians and not military German or British! The cases each are one liners. There being 30-40 per page.

Steve and I both use a very reliable middle man, who is very knowlegable, who know the Archives very well. His fees are very reasonable depending how many pages he photographs. He does not research for you! But will try his hardest to find the correct file If there is a file you want copying and there are 300 pages. Then thats what you pay for + a handling fee.

One thing I will mention is, files containing ie. British named pers may still under the 100 yr Notices. Not sure about Forein Nationals.

Alan
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steve
LE Maj
LE Maj
steve

Number of posts : 840
Age : 70
Localisation : near Cuxhaven
Cap Badge : Royal Signals + Royal Engineers
Places Served : Verden-Aller + Willich + Iserlohn + Hameln
Registration date : 2010-02-14

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 20:29

Rich, 032 Civilian Interrogation Centre was under the jurisdiction of 1st Corps District, with their headquarters in Aldershot Barracks Iserlohn, the following Army Troops were responsible for the 1st Corps District area with effect from 14 Jul 45:

2 Interrogation Team
6 Interrogation Team
17 Interrogation Section
18 Interrogation Section

Also recorded from 5 Jun 45, 90 Field Security Section was in Gartenstrasse 48 moving to Stennerstrasse 4 Iserlohn on 23 Jun 45, information taken from 2nd Army/1st Corps District documentation.

Sorry unable to find references for the above units
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RD1988
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LCpl


Number of posts : 8
Registration date : 2019-04-27

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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 20:36

Dear Steve, thank you for your reply. The problem I have is that I know the report exists, but I don't lnoe how to locate it at TNA.

Best,
Rich
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alan8376
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Number of posts : 469
Age : 71
Localisation : Norfolk, UK
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Carlisle AAS, Aden, Hildesheim, Bordon, Fallingbostel, Dover, NI Tours, Osnabruck, Herford, Muenster, UN Nicosia, SBA Dhekellia Cyprus x2, Waterbeach, Civi Street 1988. Retired from VOSA 2007.
Registration date : 2009-07-28

Civil Internment Camp No 2? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 21:14

Rich,
As a starter for one. You could use the title of the file illustrated below.

If you Pm me. I can forward to you the person's name and web address  who does work at the TNA for a number of us.
Let him know the details of what you are looking for. I am sure he will advise you if such files you seek could be stored at TNA.

Regards
Alan

Civil Internment Camp No 2? X4mnxz5


Last edited by alan8376 on 28/4/2019, 21:29; edited 2 times in total
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RD1988
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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime28/4/2019, 21:16

Thanks Alan, will do.
Best, Rich
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RD1988
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Number of posts : 8
Registration date : 2019-04-27

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PostSubject: Re: Civil Internment Camp No 2?   Civil Internment Camp No 2? Icon_minitime29/5/2019, 10:31

Hi Alan, I can't seem to find how to PM you. Could you send the contact details to my email address richard_maxwell@hotmail.co.uk?

Best,
Rich
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