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 Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!

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ScaleyDave
Cpl
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Number of posts : 19
Cap Badge : Mercury of course
Places Served : Lippstadt, Blandford, Rheindahlen, Bessbrook, Catterick
Registration date : 2013-03-01

PostSubject: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   9/4/2013, 16:14

Found this lurking in the unfashionable end of YouTube

British Army Training Film NBC: Nuclear

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_R9V4mNGMDE

We must have all seen this (or one like it) in BAOR

Did we actually believe it, just want to believe it or not?


Watching the film, I love the way it omits the fact you would probably have been in several grid locations after an attack anyway or the fact that being spread in that way was probably a far better long term option........

The one thing I dont recall at all is the "Thermal Shield" when digging a slit, pretty damm tactical when he's erected what looks like a gypsies tent.

Also note how easy the soil is to dig, no-one thrashing around with a pick at the inevitable tree root that was as tough as old boots, impervious to shovel and pick attack end ensured that any sleep was nigh on impossible!
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Shelldrake
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Number of posts : 3002
Localisation : Camberley
Cap Badge : Royal Artillery
Places Served : Troon, Lippstadt, Devizes, NI, Paderborn, Dortmund, Colchester, Belize, Canada, Cyprus, Gutersloh
Registration date : 2010-10-26

PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   9/4/2013, 17:12

By the amount of chalk coming out of the trench the film was made on Salisbury Plain. To dig down that deep with just a shovel would have taken about a week - happy days!! Laughing
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Les Pattenden
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Number of posts : 473
Age : 72
Localisation : Hampshire
Cap Badge : RCT
Places Served : Aldershot, Marchwood, Longmoor, Dusseldorf,Munster,Ratingen,Longmoor
Registration date : 2011-11-12

PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   10/4/2013, 10:40

I don't know what we could have been thinking, when told you may be on duty protecting a fallout shelter to protect VIPs, to do this not only would you be on the outside but also keep others from entering (even your nearest and dearest), can you imagine after a biological attack, to check it was safe, ordering one of your men to remove mask, it all seems such a long way off now, like it was just part of a film

Les
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Nobby
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Number of posts : 79
Age : 57
Localisation : Leicester
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Tidworth, Sennelarger, Werl, Munsterlager, Catterick, Paderborn, Ripon, Detmold, Marchwood.
Registration date : 2009-02-05

PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   12/4/2013, 09:35

I remember doing an exercise called "Liquid Chase" when i was attached to the Black Watch. The idea was to live. fight and work under NBC conditions and we had umpires from Porton Down watch our every move.
The best comment was by the umpire that was attached to my fitter section when we were out replacing a 432 Power pack.
His exact comments were " Lets face it guys, the only person that could survive under these conditions is the guy with the blue suit with the red knickers on the outside"
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Chemist
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PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   13/4/2013, 09:22

Readers may get a clue from my handle where I am "coming from " on this subject.

The B&C of the NBC suit I can just understand,a piece of carbon impregnated cloth can absorb and protect from chemical and biological agents to a certain extent.
But how was it supposed to provide protection from "nuclear effects" After all these are heat and radiation and of course fall out. Fall out is mostly particulate matter .

What were you guys in uniform told about this?

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brum
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Number of posts : 2808
Age : 76
Localisation : Sandbach Cheshire
Cap Badge : RA/QOH
Places Served : JLRRA (Hereford) Nienburg Paderborn Colchester Munster Maresfield (Cyprus) Hohne Hemer Op Banner x4 Woolwich
Registration date : 2010-03-02

PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   13/4/2013, 11:40


Our training made it clear that the NBC suit would only give protection for a short time and unless we were under cover when the nuke went off we were doomed anyway. We were supposed to be rapidly evacuated to clean up areas where vehs would be hosed down and pax decontaminated. (Twos up on the Fuller's earth !).
Towards the end of the 70s the feeling was that a nuclear attack was unlikely, because Ivan would be advancing into a radioactive rubbish heap, not much use to him, it was thought.
The thinking at the time was that agents, like the aforementioned hallucinogenics would be more effective.
Another line of thought was, why nuke anyway? How would an army perform if everybody had 'flu ? How effective would a tank crew be if they all had diarrhoea ?
Thankfully, we never had to find out ! pale
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cartav
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Number of posts : 784
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Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   16/4/2013, 12:53

Chemist wrote:
Readers may get a clue from my handle where I am "coming from " on this subject.

The B&C of the NBC suit I can just understand,a piece of carbon impregnated cloth can absorb and protect from chemical and biological agents to a certain extent....
What were you guys in uniform told about this?.............

I can't remember ever being conned into thinking that the noddy kit was going to stop the effect of being too close to a nuke, but it was supposed to give some protection from fallout in contaminated areas. Only the AFV lads were likely to have any chance of survival, they said, but even they were doomed to drop dead in three days and the top brass were urged to keep that quiet and use them whilst they were still active.

For the rest, a day working in the stuff after being told how to urinate, defecate & masticate was enough to irritate and sometimes a necessary relationship with a close mate could cause further distress....... they chucked in 'fornicate' as well in the instruction lecture but no one believed that was likely even if they'd had the energy.

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unclevanya
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Number of posts : 228
Age : 72
Localisation : Essex UK
Cap Badge : R Sigs
Places Served : 11 Sigs Vimy 'C' Catterick Nov 1963), 224 (Radio) Sig Squadron Garrats Hey, Quorn Leics( Jan-June 1964), 16 Sigs Bradbury Barracks Krefeld July-Oct 1964), 28 (BR) Sigs St Tonis & 4 Squadron, Tongeren (Cafe Maddy) (1964-1968), HQ UNFICYP Nicosia 6 month tour (1966), HMS Jufair & Hamala Camp Bahrien, 223 Sig Sqn (Radio) Winchester, Norn Ireland, HQ Northag Kolsas Olso Norway, 11 Sigs Helles Lines Catterick, Civvy Street 1977, Retired (Grumpy Victor Meldrew 2012)
Registration date : 2012-07-15

PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   16/4/2013, 18:02

Yup, we all saw that at sometime in the 1960s and later. I can remember the exercsies on the Sennelager Training Area, and ahving to dig slit trenches and cover them with materials to 'protect oneself from flash'. They were g*ggers to dig, endless sand, and you only had to dig down a couple of feet and they flooded with water as memory serves me. So we jsut dug a cursory one, titivated it up to keep the Regimental Umpires happy, then went and sat in our vehicles smoking and drinking elicit bottles of Duetche beer that someone ahd remembered to bring in their kit.... pale
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PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   16/4/2013, 20:31

Quote :
someone ahd remembered to bring in their kit....

And those who forgot??????????Put up against a wall and shot? Mad
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cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen


Number of posts : 784
Age : 87
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   18/4/2013, 14:28

Thinking back, I remember that 32(Minden) LAA Bty were honoured as being one of the units which were nuked by the first simulated big bang aimed at part of Blue Army on Exercise Battle Royal. Personally, I was on stag in the small hours. smoking a fag, warmed up after a swig of the rum jar in the BK's Champ, and at the gateway of the farm where we rested. Big flash on the horizon, DS arrived shortly after to say we were all dead. Go home ? No chance. We had three days of blanco, brasso and Kiwi, the period they said it would take to replace us with a similar unit from UK.

No noddy suits in those days, just foxholes which had to be 'L' shaped so you could hide round the corner under a 12" topping of soil....... not 18" then, like the film. German farmers must have wondered why they were losing outhouse doors, for every squaddy acquired one for his personal pit. I suppose we were lucky to have some sort of MT to carry it all. Don't know how the PBI managed........
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lab1950
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Number of posts : 17
Age : 67
Localisation : Aberdeen Scotland
Cap Badge : R.E.M.E.
Places Served : Poperinghe Barracks Arborfield Berkshire : SEE Arborfield Berkshire : SEME Bordon Hampshire : Bruneval Barracks Aldershot Hampshire : Palace Barracks Holywood Northern Ireland : Talbot Barracks Sennelager West Germany : Hobart Barracks Detmold West Germany : Mooltan Barracks Tidworth Hampshire : Drumadd Barracks Armagh Northern Ireland : Mooltan Barracks Tidworth Hampshire (again) : West Riding Barracks Dortmund West Germany : BMATT King George VI Barracks Harare Zimbabwe : West Riding Barracks Dortmund West Germany (again) : Lumsden Barracks Fallingbostel West Germany : Alanbrooke Barracks Paderborn West Germany : Tofrek Barracks Hildesheim West Germany : Smuts Barracks West Berlin : Tofrek Barracks Hildesheim West Germany (again) : SEME Bordon Hampshire (again)
Registration date : 2013-04-26

PostSubject: Re: Did we actually believe this BS or just tabwant too hope!!!   26/4/2013, 14:56

I remember having to attend a compulsory viewing of this whilst serving in Tidworth. Half way through the chief NBC instructor grabbed the film off the projector and slung it in the nearest bin whilst uttering words to the effect of "what a load of s**t if a nuke goes off that close to you your dead end of story". Sort of put an end to the forced party and more importantly none of the senior officers attending batted an eyelid at his actions.
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