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 2 New Super Carriers

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unclevanya
Maj
Maj
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Number of posts : 228
Age : 72
Localisation : Essex UK
Cap Badge : R Sigs
Places Served : 11 Sigs Vimy 'C' Catterick Nov 1963), 224 (Radio) Sig Squadron Garrats Hey, Quorn Leics( Jan-June 1964), 16 Sigs Bradbury Barracks Krefeld July-Oct 1964), 28 (BR) Sigs St Tonis & 4 Squadron, Tongeren (Cafe Maddy) (1964-1968), HQ UNFICYP Nicosia 6 month tour (1966), HMS Jufair & Hamala Camp Bahrien, 223 Sig Sqn (Radio) Winchester, Norn Ireland, HQ Northag Kolsas Olso Norway, 11 Sigs Helles Lines Catterick, Civvy Street 1977, Retired (Grumpy Victor Meldrew 2012)
Registration date : 2012-07-15

PostSubject: 2 New Super Carriers   21/2/2014, 23:29

any serving or ex-RN types think that both these 2 vessels will ever be commissioned and operational in due time, or will there just be one operational, and the other mothballed or sold off.

I have read that one will become operational whilst the other is used for training purposes tied up in Pompey Dockyard. Any comments about either of them, and the manpower strength of the current R Navy after the current round of defence cuts? silent 
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PostSubject: Re: 2 New Super Carriers   22/2/2014, 10:05

There was something recently,about the wrong type of aircraft being ordered..
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cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen


Number of posts : 783
Age : 87
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

PostSubject: Re: 2 New Super Carriers   24/2/2014, 11:42

Gordon. wrote:
There was something recently,about the wrong type of aircraft being ordered..

Wasn't it cost thingy?  I seem to remember  there was a joint programme with US to produce a  vertical take off aircraft ........ based on the F22 Raptor, to become the F35 ????....... as a Harrier
replacement and this must have been going on for ten years or more. With a diminishing threat the need for an air superiority fighter for action against the Ruskies became less of a priority. Costs for both F22 & F35 escalated & I've a suspicion that the plug might have been pulled on  both projects.  

Remember how drunken revellers would return to the billet and shake a sleeping mate to ask
" Hey! Do you want to buy a battleship? "   Same today, but the battleship is now an aircraft carrier.
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unclevanya
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Number of posts : 228
Age : 72
Localisation : Essex UK
Cap Badge : R Sigs
Places Served : 11 Sigs Vimy 'C' Catterick Nov 1963), 224 (Radio) Sig Squadron Garrats Hey, Quorn Leics( Jan-June 1964), 16 Sigs Bradbury Barracks Krefeld July-Oct 1964), 28 (BR) Sigs St Tonis & 4 Squadron, Tongeren (Cafe Maddy) (1964-1968), HQ UNFICYP Nicosia 6 month tour (1966), HMS Jufair & Hamala Camp Bahrien, 223 Sig Sqn (Radio) Winchester, Norn Ireland, HQ Northag Kolsas Olso Norway, 11 Sigs Helles Lines Catterick, Civvy Street 1977, Retired (Grumpy Victor Meldrew 2012)
Registration date : 2012-07-15

PostSubject: Re: 2 New Super Carriers   24/2/2014, 12:29

Costs overruns, will be what puts the kybosh on these. Mr Brown possibly ordered these to be designed and built as a sop to the remaining ship yards in Scotland. Whatever the reasons, why two 65 thousand tonne ships were ordered is one of the mysteries. If replacement vessels to replace the ageing 'Illustrious Class' Harrier carriers, then surely it would have been more sense to build two 32 thousand tonne class vessels of a similar size to the old Ark Royal that was used in the Falklands War.

As it is there is no guaranteed that either of these two vessels will 'go operational'. As far as one understands this, they were built as a platform for the new US VSTOL naval aircraft, but the date for their deliver was years away. Carriers with no aircraft - now there's a conundrum! There has also been suggestions that these carriers should also be fitted with conventional steam catapult systems to fly off conventional carrier based aircraft. Of course MoD are being very tight as to what is happening, or when any launch date is announced.

Future events, and I jest here -
(a) Sell them both off to the Indian Navy.
(b) Mothball one and keep the other operational to 'Fly the Flag' once every couple of years!
(c) Turn on over to GS4 to be turned into a floating asylum centre and prison.
(d) Scrap both of them.

Everything seems to be 'up in the air', whilst we are told the UK doesn't have any cash to spare, yet Mr Gideon our Chancellor of the exchequer is 'promising' oodles of tax payers cash to "rebuild the Ukraine". Our political elites are great at volunteering our cash and military whenever they have collective 'Guilt Farts' and 'Collective Guilt Trips' about Britian's Imperialist past. (Tw*ts)  What a Face Rolling Eyes 
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unclevanya
Maj
Maj
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Number of posts : 228
Age : 72
Localisation : Essex UK
Cap Badge : R Sigs
Places Served : 11 Sigs Vimy 'C' Catterick Nov 1963), 224 (Radio) Sig Squadron Garrats Hey, Quorn Leics( Jan-June 1964), 16 Sigs Bradbury Barracks Krefeld July-Oct 1964), 28 (BR) Sigs St Tonis & 4 Squadron, Tongeren (Cafe Maddy) (1964-1968), HQ UNFICYP Nicosia 6 month tour (1966), HMS Jufair & Hamala Camp Bahrien, 223 Sig Sqn (Radio) Winchester, Norn Ireland, HQ Northag Kolsas Olso Norway, 11 Sigs Helles Lines Catterick, Civvy Street 1977, Retired (Grumpy Victor Meldrew 2012)
Registration date : 2012-07-15

PostSubject: Re: 2 New Super Carriers   26/2/2014, 10:00

Hmm - Brighton Pier is a bit of a wreck. Perhaps one of those carriers could be grounded in specially prepared mooring next to the wreck of Brghton Pier, and it could be converted into a "New Pier" with casinos, a hotel, , a Pie n Mash shop, and various ot bounce her amusements. But don't tell anyone, as somebody in MoD may just take this up as a serious policy........... I jest of course as I always do...
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
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Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

PostSubject: Re: 2 New Super Carriers   26/2/2014, 17:51

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth_class_aircraft_carrier

HMS Queen Elizabeth (R08)

As of September 2013 Queen Elizabeth is 80% complete internally and her launch is scheduled for July 2014. She will then be fitted out, with the crew moving aboard in May 2016, sea trials begin in October 2016 and she will be handed over to the Royal Navy in "early 2017".

F-35 operations begin in 2018[82] ahead of an "operational military capability" in 2020
Prince of Wales

HMS Prince of Wales (R09)

The Strategic Defence and Security Review of 2010 declared that the UK needed only one carrier, but penalty clauses in the contract meant that cancelling the second vessel was more expensive than building it.

So the SDSR directed that the second carrier should be built and then either mothballed or sold.

Defence Secretary Liam Fox cut the first steel for Prince of Wales on 26 May 2011. The Prince of Wales was to be converted to a CATOBAR configuration as a result of the SDSR.

The costs of conversion escalated to £2bn so in May 2012 the government announced that it would revert to the original STOVL configuration.

The RN's 2012/13 yearbook stated "both carriers are likely to be commissioned and may even be capable of operating together".

A final decision on the fate of the second carrier will be taken as part of the 2015 SDSR; under current plans it will be commissioned in 2020.[86]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Future_of_the_Royal_Air_Force

The Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II F-35B

The Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II is a family of single-seat, single-engine, fifth generation multirole fighters under development to perform ground attack, reconnaissance, and air defence missions with stealth capability. It was selected for the UK's Joint Combat Aircraft requirement in 2001 and is expected to enter service with the RAF and the Royal Navy around 2020, replacing the existing Tornado GR4 and Harrier GR9 fleets (the latter already having been retired in late 2010), and operating from the Queen Elizabeth class aircraft carriers. It will be the main component of the RAF's manned strike capability. The F-35 has been designed to have a low radar cross section primarily due to stealthy materials used in construction, including fibre mat.

The version initially selected was Short Take Off Vertical Landing (STOVL) variant of the F-35, known as the F-35B. However, on 19 October 2010, David Cameron announced that the UK would change their order to the F-35C CATOBAR carrier variant for both the RAF and Navy. The F-35C variant features larger wings with foldable wingtip sections, larger wing and tail control surfaces for improved low-speed control. This gives it a greater range and the ability to carry a larger and more diverse payload than the F-35B.

In May 2012, it was announced that the UK coalition government had reverted to the previous government's plan to operate the Short Take Off Vertical Landing F-35B, due to rising estimated shipbuilding costs associated with the CATOBAR variant F-35C, and an earlier estimated in-service date for the F-35B.[5]

The delivery of the UK's first F-35B was made on the 19 July 2012 at Fort Worth, Texas, for flight trials by the RAF and Royal Navy.

There are now two RAF F-35B Short Take Off Vertical Landing (STOVL) variants ungoing trials.

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Shelldrake
FM
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Number of posts : 2994
Localisation : Camberley
Cap Badge : Royal Artillery
Places Served : Troon, Lippstadt, Devizes, NI, Paderborn, Dortmund, Colchester, Belize, Canada, Cyprus, Gutersloh
Registration date : 2010-10-26

PostSubject: Re: 2 New Super Carriers   27/2/2014, 08:11

I got two brand new super carriers from my local Sainsbury's yesterday.
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