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 The very last British Military Train

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steve
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Number of posts : 796
Age : 69
Localisation : near Cuxhaven
Cap Badge : Royal Signals + Royal Engineers
Places Served : Verden-Aller + Willich + Iserlohn + Hameln
Registration date : 2010-02-14

PostSubject: The very last British Military Train   29/4/2018, 18:39

Auf Wiedersehen BAOR special train in June 2019

The journey and the narrative focuses particularly on the 1945-1949 rehabilitation of Germany by British military engineers and logisticians rebuilding civic society – power, transport and water – using old-fashioned make-do-and mend. It is not widely recognised that Germany in 1945 was the worst man made humanitarian crisis in European history: 30 million people including the homeless civilians, PoWs, DPs, and a relatively tiny British Liberation Army. .

This narrative is supported by the Founding Director of RLCDavid Burden,

The Luftwaffe have provided Enough financial support for a discounted “Served in Germany” fare. Before the 1963 reorganisation, CRE owned almost all the technical expertise, from port clearance to waterways and postal service. And the second British Military Governor in Germany was himself a Royal Engineer, having been the Deputy from 1945.

Finally, in the spirit of British Military Trains – RE(Tn) and RCT, and of BAOR – this train has more Bar Cars than the Venice-Simplon Orient Express!

Please click on the link below for full details of how to take part in this event

http://www.reahq.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/FAREWELL-TRAIN-ITINERARY-Download-v2.pdf
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JPW
Let Gen
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Number of posts : 1074
Age : 77
Localisation : Berkshire
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   10/5/2018, 08:24

I too was initially tempted to join the trip but decided a self funded journey would be more economical

Had the privilege of corresponding with the late David Carpenter who first went to Berlin in 1948 and became an acknowledged expert on the BAOR British Military train system, some of the detail appears on this Forum.

Mention of alcohol reminds me that a a unique feature of the long distance British military trains (including the Berliner) was that alcohol was on sale with the meals (the French and US equivalents were dry.) There were even specially designed Buffet Cars operated by NAAFI for a time. These had to be detached before crossing into Holland as they sold duty free alcohol and cigarettes.
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burgess720
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PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   11/5/2018, 00:49

JPW wrote:
I too was initially tempted to join the trip but decided a self funded journey would be more economical

Had the privilege of corresponding with the late David Carpenter who first went to Berlin in 1948 and became an acknowledged expert on the BAOR  British Military train system, some of the detail appears on this Forum.

Mention of alcohol reminds me that a a unique feature of the long distance British military trains (including the Berliner) was that alcohol was on sale with the meals (the French and US equivalents were dry.) There were even specially designed Buffet Cars operated by NAAFI for a time. These had to be detached before crossing into Holland as they sold duty free alcohol and cigarettes.


A sad time, but things change; part of our earlier life
I miss my corresponding with David Carpenter

The NAAFI Buffet cars were ex 1930's German standard rolling stock, I have a photo of No. 14 standing on its own Osnabruck high level in September 1952
Maybe they were being detached at Osnabruck instead of Dutch border at that time

Am now a bit old to travel to Germany again, many good memories

Regards
Sapper in Sydney
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JPW
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Number of posts : 1074
Age : 77
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Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   14/5/2018, 16:04

Burgess

Good to hear from you

According to the map David sent me the Buffet Cars were detached at either Krefeld or Osnabruck not theactual Border to restock the contents and give the Staff a suitable rest break

Have still to discover anyone who remembers travelling on the BAOR Special (with Buffet Car) from Hamburg Altona and Cologne via Hannover stopping at all the major Garrisons

Incidentally were you aware that the old Hamburg Altona terminus an important node for BAOR travel in the late 1940's and 1950's is to close completely shortly?. A replacement and smaller through station is to be built on the site of the old steam engine sheds.
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burgess720
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PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   15/5/2018, 02:58

JPW wrote:
Burgess

Good to hear from you

According to the map David sent me the Buffet Cars were detached at either Krefeld or Osnabruck not theactual Border to restock the contents and give the Staff a suitable rest break

Have still to discover anyone who remembers travelling on the BAOR Special (with Buffet Car) from Hamburg Altona and Cologne via Hannover stopping at all the major  Garrisons

Incidentally were you aware that the old Hamburg Altona terminus an important node for BAOR travel in the late 1940's and 1950's is to close completely shortly?. A replacement and smaller through station is to be built on the site of the old steam engine sheds.


Hi, such a long time ago.
Feb 1951 posted to Germany, got on train at Hook and got off Hannover, to a transit camp, did I go via Krefeld???
Posted to Osnabruck, but that was by civvy train, on my own, Hannover to Osnabruck
Back on a course and another time on leave, to and from Osnabruck

The Military trains were impressive, comfort and service

Regards
Sapper
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JPW
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Number of posts : 1074
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Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   21/5/2018, 10:50

Sapper

Am almost certain from the information that David sent me you would have travelled on the Blue Train which terminated in Hamburg Altona. You would have crossed the border at Bentheim then stopped at Rhiene (with connection to Munster), Osnabruck, Bad Oeynhausen, Minden, Buckeburg, Wunstorf and then Hannover HBF served

Steve is the expert on Hannover but think your transit camp was adjacent to the RAF Station in the northern outskirts of the city at Langenhagen.
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burgess720
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PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   22/5/2018, 01:06

JPW wrote:
Sapper

Am almost certain from the information that David sent me you would have travelled on the Blue Train which terminated in Hamburg Altona. You would have crossed the border at Bentheim then stopped at Rhiene (with connection to Munster), Osnabruck, Bad Oeynhausen, Minden, Buckeburg, Wunstorf and then Hannover HBF served

Steve is the expert on Hannover but think your transit camp was adjacent to the RAF Station in the northern outskirts of the city at Langenhagen.


Hi,
Thanks for confirming, remember Bentheim, seem to think a change of locomotives. took a fair time from memory, electric lco in Holland but steam in Germany

Regards
Sapper
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steve
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Number of posts : 796
Age : 69
Localisation : near Cuxhaven
Cap Badge : Royal Signals + Royal Engineers
Places Served : Verden-Aller + Willich + Iserlohn + Hameln
Registration date : 2010-02-14

PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   22/5/2018, 08:43

According to the late 1948 Hannover District location statement, 125 Transit Camp was in Wavell Barracks formally General Wever Kaserne Hannover-Bothfeld to the south-east of Langenhagen, this could have changed in later years, up to early 1949 is the limit of my BAOR research for now
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JPW
Let Gen
Let Gen


Number of posts : 1074
Age : 77
Localisation : Berkshire
Cap Badge : REME
Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   23/5/2018, 11:44

Sapper

Your memory of the Bentheim stop is correct

Have a photo originally sent to me by David C of a short tender 03 Pacific heading out of Osnabruck heading for Bentheim hauling the Blue Train.
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steve
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Number of posts : 796
Age : 69
Localisation : near Cuxhaven
Cap Badge : Royal Signals + Royal Engineers
Places Served : Verden-Aller + Willich + Iserlohn + Hameln
Registration date : 2010-02-14

PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   24/5/2018, 08:46

These days here is a Deutsche Bahn loco hauled Inter City every two hours from Amsterdam to Berlin, with a loco change at Bad Bentheim, have used the Osnabrück to Amsterdam portion a couple of times when flying over to the UK, will use again in the future to connect to the recently introduced Eurostar service Amsterdam to London Very Happy
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burgess720
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PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   25/5/2018, 00:31

JPW wrote:
Sapper

Your memory of the Bentheim stop is correct

Have a photo originally sent to me by David C of a short tender 03 Pacific heading out of Osnabruck heading for Bentheim hauling the Blue Train.

Hi all,

Interesting current situation from Steve

Osnabruck station was unusual, having high level and low lever platforms forming a cross; high level east to west and low level north to south. [Did I get this right?]

From memory incoming Blue train would arrive on high level, then turn 90 degrees round a large loop line, turning north round to pass through the low level and head south. I think Blue train only stopped at the high level and not low level, which is where I saw a NAAFI car. Likely also a loco change there
In early 1950's out the front of the station was a large area totally cleared of damage, obviously such a junction was an important target

Current photos of Osnabruck centre I cant place, changed so much. Where exactly was the Globe cinema [a Nissen building] From Roberts Barracks we caught the tram to Neumarkt [tram tickets still said Adolf Hitler Platz] then we turned into a street ? past a building still a pile of rubble, said to have been an officers club, Germans crossed to the other side of the road to pass it; then we went through a large hole in a brick wall onto a paved area in front of the Globe, behind it was a large "government type' of building, either undamaged or rebuilt.

A long time ago, but happy times in BAOR

Regards, Sapper

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JPW
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Number of posts : 1074
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Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   25/5/2018, 08:19

Sapper

You partially correct, engines were changed on the Blue Train at Osnabruck High Level which was adjacent to the main Steam Locomotive Sheds (largely passenger locos). There was a second engine shed housing mainly goods engines adjacent to the low level freight marshalling yards. The High Level station served the north-south route (Hamburg/Bremen- The Ruhr), Low Level the east-west (((Berlin) Hannover- Holland)
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JPW
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Number of posts : 1074
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Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

PostSubject: Re: The very last British Military Train   25/5/2018, 10:16

Forgot to mention that it is now impossible to repeat the Troop Train journeys of the past exactly.

The car ferries from Harwich now dock elsewhere in the much expanded Rotterdam Europort, the quays at the Hoek are now closed to ferry traffic and the "heavy rail" lines have now been incorporated in the much enlarged Rotterdam Metro Tram system. Long distance passenger rail traffic from the Hoek has therefore ceased.
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