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AuthorMessage
Stephen Lock
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Stephen Lock

Number of posts : 937
Age : 66
Localisation : Calgary
Cap Badge : Pads Brat
Places Served : Father -- Canadian Army. Served Hemer, Soest, and Wetter
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 04:21

Regarding the number of non-uniforms in the Legions.

One of our local papers recently did a series of articles on the demise of the Royal Canadian Legions, many of which are either shutting down or on danger of doing so as membership wanes (everyone is dying off...even Korean War vets are 'old boys' now) and, as a matter of survival, have opened their doors to non-vets. You come up with membership fees, you're in, basically.

Of course, "The Legion" has a certain image to overcome, that of being a slightly down-at-the-mouth, no-frills place of old guys and gals to drink. And, while that's true to a certain extent, it's the charity work on behalf of vets and their families that the Legion needs to keep going for, hence the opening up of the membership.
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 09:36

Same in the Royal British Legion Steve, Non-Serving members who support the aims of the RBL are now given full membership & voting rights at the AGM and may stand for office. BUT the RBL only support ex-servicemen (members or not) and the Poppy Appeal is still well supported.

In our local town we no longer have a Legion Club and meet once a month at the local Working Mens Club and our membership is up this year, and we also have the local Army Cadet Force as an Affiliated Unit, and the support of the Army Foundation Collage at Pennypot (former R Sigs Apprentice Collage) who we try to sign up as 'Serving Members'
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Teabag
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Teabag

Number of posts : 960
Age : 69
Localisation : Merseyside
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Wildenrath Detmold
Registration date : 2008-10-30

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 10:12

I was a member of the Legion when I left the army but we moved and I lapsed it.

Last year I decided to rejoin at my local one. I duly filled out the forms and was surprised and a bit annoyed to find there was no real mention of service in the forces on the forms. Just if you served, which branch?

That aside, I filled it in and gave direct debit details etc and handed it to one of the guys at the club. Never heard anything for ages and in the end emailed the HQ. They said there was a delay in processing members. This from an organisation that is supposed to be crying out for members.

They added that my membership would start from September. Considering I applied in June, I was a bit peeved to say the least to be only getting nine months membership but having to pay in full. I objected and said why do you not have a rolling membership instead of everyone renewing in September but they never bothered to reply.

When I eventually got my card through, I immediately cancelled the direct debit and told them why. No reply. I have never entered the club since getting my card and it is only around the corner from my house. Cut my nose off to spite my face, maybe? I feel badly let down and if they don't sort themselves out then more clubs will shut and they only have themselves to blame. £16 for nothing!
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Hardrations
Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 13:00

Here in Winnipeg one of the main reasons for Legions closing down, is that the inner core of Legion groups left here, DON'T want to share power with the new members. It's almost incestious. As excutive members do not welcome new members, even veterns. These old crocks see their local Legion as THEIR group, not something to be shared and passed on. They say they represent veterans interest. Try to get one of the groups to help you. It's not possible.
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Guest
Guest



Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 14:11

Quote :
(former R Sigs Apprentice Collage)

Being a bit picky here Mike.The correct title is "Army Apprentices College"
I know they eventually became badged R Sigs.but it never featured in the title.
As i said just being picky Very Happy
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Guest
Guest



Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 14:16

16 Quid Teabag???It`s only a tenner here but like you i have paid my last
In the RBLS club here,you are looked on with suspicion if you are ex service. Sad
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 17:22

Gordon. wrote:
Quote :
(former R Sigs Apprentice Collage)

Being a bit picky here Mike.The correct title is "Army Apprentices College"
I know they eventually became badged R Sigs.but it never featured in the title.
As i said just being picky Very Happy

Be as picky as you like Gordon, but it ended its life as the 'R Sigs Apprentice Collage' and thats what it became known as, even if it was not the correct title!
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 17:40

When you join the RBL Teabag you should be given a temporary membership card to the use the branch or club facilities, and if they stated your membership started in September then surly they gave you 3 months free membership to bring you in-line to re-newel dates?
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Teabag
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Teabag

Number of posts : 960
Age : 69
Localisation : Merseyside
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Wildenrath Detmold
Registration date : 2008-10-30

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 19:39

Mike_2817 wrote:
When you join the RBL Teabag you should be given a temporary membership card to the use the branch or club facilities, and if they stated your membership started in September then surly they gave you 3 months free membership to bring you in-line to re-newel dates?

No, Not offered nor given. I did make the case to HQ that if I joined in August I would have paid a years subs for a month. No reply.
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mjm34
Maj
Maj
mjm34

Number of posts : 262
Age : 69
Localisation : Gtr Manchester
Cap Badge : R.Signals
Places Served : BAOR, UK, Mid East, Far East, Cent America
Registration date : 2009-02-21

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 20:17

Gordon. wrote:
Quote :
(former R Sigs Apprentice Collage)

Being a bit picky here Mike.The correct title is "Army Apprentices College"
I know they eventually became badged R Sigs.but it never featured in the title.
As i said just being picky Very Happy

True about "Army Apprentices College" the official abbreviation being "Army App Coll" and not as most thought "AAC" which is the official abbreviation for the Army Air Corps. Having said that I always used to give my address as Scott Sqn, AAC Harrogate. The first time I was ever "bollocked" for calling it AAC Harrogate (as in list all former units) was by the Chief Clerk at Middle Wallop. I wonder why? Anyway, he was a Gunner so what did he know Very Happy

By the time the place changed from Army Apprentices School to Army Apprentices College it was in fact all R Signals, although most of the non-trade Permanent Staff came from all Corps and Regiments. In fact when I joined in 1966 we still wore the AAS badges and lanyard even though it was a College by then.

If you want to be really picky of course it should be either Royal Corps of Signals or R Signals. Never R Sigs.

Cheers Mike
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mjm34
Maj
Maj
mjm34

Number of posts : 262
Age : 69
Localisation : Gtr Manchester
Cap Badge : R.Signals
Places Served : BAOR, UK, Mid East, Far East, Cent America
Registration date : 2009-02-21

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 20:29

Mike_2817 wrote:
Same in the Royal British Legion Steve, Non-Serving members who support the aims of the RBL are now given full membership & voting rights at the AGM and may stand for office. BUT the RBL only support ex-servicemen (members or not) and the Poppy Appeal is still well supported.

In our local town we no longer have a Legion Club and meet once a month at the local Working Mens Club and our membership is up this year, and we also have the local Army Cadet Force as an Affiliated Unit, and the support of the Army Foundation Collage at Pennypot (former R Sigs Apprentice Collage) who we try to sign up as 'Serving Members'

Not sure if it is still the same now, but when I belatedly joined in the '90s you were automatically accepted if you were ex-forces, but had to be approved by the membership committee of the club if not.

I'm not sure if the non ex-service members all support the aims of the Legion. It seems to me that most are only there for the cheaper booze.

Cheers Mike
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 21:45

Agreed, which is why my branch is more ex-services becouse we do not have a club, and only meet once a month in a working mens club. While the charter may state 'support the aims' I also doubt if many care.

RBL Full Membership is now open to all, with no need for approval by a membership committee for none ex services. You pays your £11 and normally £2 club fee and your in!

Re 'Royal Signals' et al, Being ex RAOC I wrote 'R Sigs' just to wind you buggers up LoL - In the years I know the collage, they wore Royal Signals Cap & Collar badges of course!
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Teabag
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Teabag

Number of posts : 960
Age : 69
Localisation : Merseyside
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Wildenrath Detmold
Registration date : 2008-10-30

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 22:27

How come it costs £16 to join my local one? Surely they should all be the same?

Anyway if you are ex forces it should be cheaper than civvies.
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Guest
Guest



Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime24/5/2010, 22:52

Quote :
By the time the place changed from Army Apprentices School to Army Apprentices College it was in fact all R Signals,

It was all R Signals after the last REs passed out in Dec 61.59A intake.mjm

When did they start wearing "Jimmy"
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Stephen Lock
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Stephen Lock

Number of posts : 937
Age : 66
Localisation : Calgary
Cap Badge : Pads Brat
Places Served : Father -- Canadian Army. Served Hemer, Soest, and Wetter
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 04:50

Sorry to hear about the difficulties joining one's local Legion Teabag experienced and the 'mine-mine-mine' mentality of others mentioned by Hardrations, had but not surprised. I spent a lot of years serving on the boards of various non-profit groups of one description or another and frequently encountered just this sort of mindset...the crying out for members to keep the organization active but hardly a welcoming atmosphere present from the Old Guard within it. Such are the vagaries of human beings, I suppose.

The old soldiers resent civvies coming in and the civvies have little or no understanding, and probably couldn't care less anyway, about the vets and their stories. Shame all way around, actually.

Certainly we need something in place to keep an eye out for vets. I sometimes wonder where the guys who are in AF now are going to be in 10 or 20 years and who's going to be there for them and their families, especially for the guys suffering PTSD (a fellow I went to school with and whose father served under mine recently returned from AF and is having one helluva time...and he's a high ranking officer now!). If not the Legion, then who or what? The government? Not likely!!!!
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ciphers
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
ciphers

Number of posts : 973
Age : 86
Localisation : Abbotsford, British Columbia, Canada V2S 7C5
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Catterick (1951) - BAOR (1952 -1954)-(Herford - Bunde - Munster) - Japan (Kure) - Korea (Pusan - Seoul) - Cyprus (Nicosia) - Suez Op (1st Guards Brigade) - UK (63 Sigs Regt TA, Southampton)
Registration date : 2008-06-30

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 05:29

I joined the Royal Canadian Legion in 1966 .. I quit in 2008, after 40 plus years I never felt at home there.
Notice my new avatar ... now that is a club.

Len (Ciphers)
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http://lenpayne.com/Len_Payne/Jim_Chapman.html
Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 11:16

I am a secretary of an RAOC Association Branch and recruit nationally and internationally, while others branches keep to a set area. Our membership is ex RAOC and attached personel, and most Regiments & Corps have such an Association.

Here in the UK help is available from the Veterans Welfare Service, via SSAFA or RBL Welfare Officers as well as Citizens Advice and other organisations.

http://www.veterans-uk.info/

My Association uses the SSAFA and/or RBL Case Workers to assess if a case needs assistance, and each case is assessed on immediate need, so no the RBL is not the only ex-service orgisation that cares for ex-services in the UK

What is needed in many RBL Branches is fresh blood, Serving members are now also permitted in the RBL and the younger ex-services and others.

Committees are elected yearly and can be voted out you know! and here lays the problem, get to many non-serving members and they can now take over.

I am happy to say that my local branch is still controlled by those who are interested in the aims of the RBL and I work on the Poppy Appeal Sub-Committee. (which is not just a 4 week job by the way)

P.S. Like the badge Len. Are you (and anybody else who served in the British Armed Forces for that matter) aware that there is a UK Veterons Badge available for free?

Legion Badge

See http://www.veterans-uk.info/vets_badge/vets_badge.htm
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PaddyQ
Sgt
Sgt
PaddyQ

Number of posts : 25
Age : 76
Localisation : Strabane. Tyrone. N. Ireland
Cap Badge : R Innisk Fus / RAOC
Places Served : M Gladbach. Fallingbostel. Osnabruck
Registration date : 2008-05-14

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 11:44

The RBL's performance in looking after ex forces personnel is outstanding, which proves that somewhere within the organisation there is a competent, dedicated and committed bunch of people running things.
Such competence etc is not always visible at Branch level unfortunately.
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oldtimer
WOII
WOII
oldtimer

Number of posts : 99
Age : 72
Localisation : Manchester
Cap Badge : RCT
Places Served : Yeovil, Bunde, Lubbecke,camp du larzac, norway,rct winter training centre hinterstien, Aldershot,
Registration date : 2009-09-22

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 12:14

yes paddyq they do an excellent job the problem is some branches like mike says have been taken over by non serving committies but this is the fault of ex service men and women not supporting there local branches, something of which i for one are guilty of as due to a medical problem i can no longer drink alchol so stopped going in as the temptation was to great.

but last year i came across the royal british legion riders branch set up in 2004 for ex service men and women who are keen motorcyclists.We have members from The Royal Navy, The Army, The Royal Air Force and The Royal Marines as well as those who have not served, but wish to support the Royal British Legion through the Riders Branch. though most of the riders are ex service and have raised money for the poppy appeal and in june are going to be riding 1000miles in 24hr for the appeal.

the aims of the legion remain the same although i agree the clubs leave a lot to be desired but it is not there fault that due to finances they have only two options close or allow non service personel in and remain open.
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 13:49

oldtimer wrote:
the aims of the legion remain the same although i agree the clubs leave a lot to be desired but it is not there fault that due to finances they have only two options close or allow non service personel in and remain open.

I agree, but the clubs could have admitted 'Associate' members to create the profit instead of opening the RBL to all as they did.

Here in Harrogate we closed our club a number of years back, and it re-opened as the 'Ex-Serviceman's Club' and is used by a number of groups for meetings and a drink etc.

I feel our branch is better off due to the fact it is not seen as a cheap drinking club, and as Paddy says we have a Welfare Committee supported by County to deal with those cases of need in our area.

The Poppy Appeal in our area raised nearly £60,000 towards the £33 Million raised nationally in aid of ex-servicemen & close relatives.
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ciphers
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
ciphers

Number of posts : 973
Age : 86
Localisation : Abbotsford, British Columbia, Canada V2S 7C5
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Catterick (1951) - BAOR (1952 -1954)-(Herford - Bunde - Munster) - Japan (Kure) - Korea (Pusan - Seoul) - Cyprus (Nicosia) - Suez Op (1st Guards Brigade) - UK (63 Sigs Regt TA, Southampton)
Registration date : 2008-06-30

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 18:15

Hi Mike, yes most ex Pat's over here know about the Veterans badge as it is widely circulated through the Legion Magazine and the Avavets (my mob) as well as some regimental associations.
I got mine as soon as they came out for my grouping, remember they were a staged release initially.
I do wear mine when in Association garb although from other lists I see that many do not due to the 'wannabees' getting their hands on them.
Len (Ciphers)
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http://lenpayne.com/Len_Payne/Jim_Chapman.html
mjm34
Maj
Maj
mjm34

Number of posts : 262
Age : 69
Localisation : Gtr Manchester
Cap Badge : R.Signals
Places Served : BAOR, UK, Mid East, Far East, Cent America
Registration date : 2009-02-21

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 19:45

Gordon. wrote:
Quote :
By the time the place changed from Army Apprentices School to Army Apprentices College it was in fact all R Signals,

It was all R Signals after the last REs passed out in Dec 61.59A intake.mjm

When did they start wearing "Jimmy"

Hi Gordon
When I joined in '66 we were still wearing AAS insignia, apart from the Senior Sqn, i.e; those who were graduating that term, who wore R Signals gear.

From memory, which seems to be failing a lot recently Very Happy , I changed over to the Jimmy cap badge & collar dogs, blue lanyard (on the right shoulder instead of the GS Corps on the left) and Royal Signals shoulder flashes on BD (yes BD!) around Nov/Dec 1966.

Edit
Oh yeah! We also got the all blue No1/No2 dress hat instead of the ones we had previously, which according to the label inside was the Devon & Dorsets. Must have been the same one for the General Service Corps?
End Edit


Last edited by mjm34 on 25/5/2010, 20:13; edited 1 time in total
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 20:00

ciphers wrote:
Hi Mike, yes most ex Pat's over here know about the Veterans badge as it is widely circulated through the Legion Magazine and the Avavets (my mob) as well as some regimental associations.
I got mine as soon as they came out for my grouping, remember they were a staged release initially.
I do wear mine when in Association garb although from other lists I see that many do not due to the 'wannabees' getting their hands on them.
Len (Ciphers)

Normally you can spot the 'wannabees' same as the medal wearers, as they do not last 30 seconds talking to them!

_________________
Sua Tela Tonanti
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mjm34
Maj
Maj
mjm34

Number of posts : 262
Age : 69
Localisation : Gtr Manchester
Cap Badge : R.Signals
Places Served : BAOR, UK, Mid East, Far East, Cent America
Registration date : 2009-02-21

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 20:14

Mike_2817 wrote:
ciphers wrote:
Hi Mike, yes most ex Pat's over here know about the Veterans badge as it is widely circulated through the Legion Magazine and the Avavets (my mob) as well as some regimental associations.
I got mine as soon as they came out for my grouping, remember they were a staged release initially.
I do wear mine when in Association garb although from other lists I see that many do not due to the 'wannabees' getting their hands on them.
Len (Ciphers)

Normally you can spot the 'wannabees' same as the medal wearers, as they do not last 30 seconds talking to them!

Must admit that I never bothered to apply for mine either.
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Legion Empty
PostSubject: Re: Legion   Legion Icon_minitime25/5/2010, 21:02

mjm34 wrote:

Hi Gordon
When I joined in '66 we were still wearing AAS insignia, apart from the Senior Sqn, i.e; those who were graduating that term, who wore R Signals gear.

From memory, which seems to be failing a lot recently Very Happy , I changed over to the Jimmy cap badge & collar dogs, blue lanyard (on the right shoulder instead of the GS Corps on the left) and Royal Signals shoulder flashes on BD (yes BD!) around Nov/Dec 1966.

Edit
Oh yeah! We also got the all blue No1/No2 dress hat instead of the ones we had previously, which according to the label inside was the Devon & Dorsets. Must have been the same one for the General Service Corps?
End Edit

I moved to Harrogate in 1986 and I am sure they were all wearing the Jimmy by then, by that time the Junior Leaders had moved to Harrogate from Catterick as well. Would that have anything to do wth it?

_________________
Sua Tela Tonanti
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