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 Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948

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iwlego
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PostSubject: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   11/1/2014, 20:53

Hi all,

I am in the final stage of restoration of a BAOR VW beetle, delivered in July 1948 to the

15th vehicle coy, BAOR RAOC.

I want to bring back the car in its original condition including the correct color code and the tactical markings.

My questions:

Does anybody have the code of the so called "service green" color?
What tactical signs have been on this car. Typically, those BAOR cars had two signs on the front hood and two on the engine lid.
Where was the 15th vehicle coy RAOC stationed, anybody know the barracks name(s)?

Any help and picture of a similar car would be appreciated!

Best regards

Richard
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Shelldrake
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   12/1/2014, 12:56

Hi Richard, can't help much I'm afraid but you might be able to glean some info from this thread:-


British Army VW Beetle (1950s)
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steve
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   12/1/2014, 14:36

Welcome Richard

You will find a reference here 15 Coy RASC this puts then in Cromwell Barracks Hamm in 1948

Have plenty books on the history of the VW Beetle with specifications and chassis numbers but no paint codes will try and find out for you and drop you a PM if successful

Best regards
Steve
study
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steve
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   12/1/2014, 15:07

Just found this Miltary Beetle taken from the forum if you have not found it yet HMVF
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iwlego
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   12/1/2014, 16:25

Hi Steve,

thanks for the help.

I am really not an expert, but is this really the 15 Veh Coy RAOC on the page you emphasize? I think it is RASC! Or is it the same?

By the way, I had found the picture you mentioned in the second response. The issue now is the color code (like RAL xxxx). Some people say, it is RAL 6003. But I am not sure ...

Thanks

Richard
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steve
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   12/1/2014, 17:24

Sorry my mistake...we have a member Mike who is an RAOC expert hopefully he can help...have found some paint codes will send you a PM
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steve
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   12/1/2014, 17:44

Richard PM sent
Have a look here 15 Veh Coy RAOC the article refers to 17 Veh Coy ROAC but if you scroll down you will see a mention of Varrelbusch which is near Delmenhorst north Germany
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JPW
Let Gen
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Number of posts : 1003
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Places Served : Rotenburg Ploen Lippstadt Hamm Wetter Minden Munster Bielefeldt Dusseldorf
Registration date : 2008-11-09

PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   12/1/2014, 20:32

Richard

Welcome, this is just the sort of query that some members of this site enjoy researching

Webmaster Steve has produced you some basic facts and hopefully Mike may be able to produce an authorative reply

We had a similar query about 2/3 years ago when another Beetle enthusiast was seeking to restore a similar vintage military vehicle to its original condition when used by the SSO Lippstadt. If you can find the postings in the Forum archives it might give you some more hints.

You mention the two signs on the bonnet and rear mud guards. They would have been the Formation Sign and Unit TAC Sign the latter comprising a black number on a background of three equispaced vertical scarlet, royal blue, scarlet stripes denoting the RAOC ownership (but see my later comments

Steve has a detailed knowledge of BAOR units in the immediate post war period and has referred you to a submission of the main page of the master BAOR Locations site. I would comment that the 15/16/17 Vehicle Companies were the remnants of the Wartime RAOC Vehicle Supply Organisation and were concerned in 1947/8 with the final disposal of redundant equipment. As stated in the document this was being replaced by a new RAOC Organisation based largely on Ayrshire Barracks Moenchen Gladbach which was to remain in place for the nest fifty plus years. I have been unable to identify a 15 Vehicle Company RAOC in existence in 1948 from other sources available to me. In any case I believe that this unit, or its equivalent, received the vehicle when new from the Volkswagen Works at Wolfsburg, carried ot certain additional checks and military documentation before the vehicle was sent to its longterm owner unit elsewhere in BAOR

Where did you find the title 15 Vehicle Company RAOC? Do you have a copy of the original vehicle log book which would give details of its history?
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iwlego
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   12/1/2014, 22:02

Hi,

I got the "15 Vehicle Company RAOC" from Volkswagen Archive. They have an exact trace of where all Volkswagen beetle were delivered to.
Of course, could be a mistake in the spelling when extracted from the archive.

I would also assume, that this unit is just the receiving unit and that those beetles have then been deployed in various units. I have several B/W photos of such cars.

I have no copy of the original log book. I bought the car in Austria, it was used as civil car for many years and painted several times, finally just in black. I am a Volkswagen beetle collector and as a matter of fact, I have two beetles from 1946 and 1947 delivered to the US Army, one from 1946 delivered to the French Army and one from 1948 delivered to the British Army.

Thanks and best regards

Richard
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JPW
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   13/1/2014, 22:29

Richard

My advice would be to restore your vehicle to as new ex Factory conditions with military number plate but no Formation or Unit TAC signs
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steve
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   14/1/2014, 08:31

Looking through the Historical Military Vehicle Forum the front number plates did not come in until later in the first British Army ones had the registration number stencilled on the bonnet
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JPW
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Number of posts : 1003
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   14/1/2014, 11:03

Brian

Without the vehicle documents it is going to be impossible to identify the working unit who first owned your Beetle.

However I believe that 15 Company were probably responsible for vehicle issues to units in the following area of the then British Zone of Occupation, east of the River Weser, north of the Dortmund-Ems Canal west of the Dutch Border. This contained the imprtant British Garrisons of Munster and Osnabruck as well as Headquarters BAOR proper in Bad Oeynhausen and its satellite Headquarters in the Bielefeld/ Herford area

17 Company in Hamburg could have been responsible for units in the northeast sector.the newly forming Depot in Moenchen Gladbach the southern sector
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Mike_2817
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   15/1/2014, 13:51

Post D-Day there were 4 Veh Companies - 14, 15, 16 & 17 Veh Companies, each with 4 Veh Parks, a returns park & a transit park.

By 1945 15 Veh Company had its HQ at CVD Varrelbusch which contained unfit vehicles required for repair in BAOR Wksps but also 151,152,153 & 154 Vehicle Parks which were useing some of the Autobahn Systen to store vehicles in the open.

After 1948 all Vehicle Holding were slowly run down and 17 Base Vehicle Depot at M.Gladbach took control of BAOR Vehicle Holding.

RAOC Units used the 21 Army Group sign on its own vehicles, and many of the returned vehicles still had Formation Signs of many differant units. However New Vehicles from Trade would have no unit markings at all, and may have had Oil Change and/or Coolant Change details stencilled on the inside of windscreen on the non drivers side.

All Military Veh's were accounted for by its Registration Number, and vehicles such as VW Beetles would have this allocated at the factory by the Military Purchasing Authority.

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iwlego
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   15/1/2014, 21:27

Hi guys,

thanks for the info. Very helpful.

Does anybody have a color code for the olive green (service green) of postwar military cars from the British army.

A RAL number?

Thanks

Richard
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Mike_2817
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   15/1/2014, 22:59

Take a look at RAL 6003 in Matt

http://army-uk.info/color-ral.php

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iwlego
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   17/1/2014, 01:05

Hi, I will use RAL 6003!

Just another question: Are the following CCG beetle from the British Army? Any idea?



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Mike_2817
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   24/1/2014, 09:51

Not the Army as such - The Control Commission for Germany (British Element) was as its full title surgests, the British element of the Allied [civlion] Control Authority (later Council) in (West) Germany

Relations between the Western Allies (especially the United States and the United Kingdom) and the Soviet Union quickly deteriorated, and so did their cooperation in the administration of occupied Germany. Within each zone each power ran its own administration, such as the

Gouvernement Militaire de la Zone Française d'Occupation en Allemagne (GMZFO) in Karlsruhe,

the Советская военная администрация в Германии (СВАГ); Sovetskaia Voennaia Administratsia v Germanii (SVAG) in East Berlin,

the Control Commission for Germany - British Element (CCG/BE) in Bad Oeynhausen,

the Office of Military Government, United States (OMGUS) in West Berlin and Frankfurt upon Main.

They did however receive a number of staff/utility cars including captured vehicles which were all regeistered with CCG numbers, later they received new VW's via British Vehicle Depots.

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iwlego
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   24/1/2014, 12:42

Thanks! This is very helpful information!

Richard
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iwlego
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   18/4/2014, 08:43

Hi, can not upload the picture, but it is the one with the guy standing next to it in the threat already.

Thanks for your help!

Richard
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iwlego
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   29/7/2014, 02:09

Hi all,

my 1948 BAOR Volkswagen is ready and a little masterpiece of restoration!

Here are a few pictures ...







Richard
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Sinclair
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   2/12/2015, 17:04

Hi. Really interesting. I had a 52 BAoR car a few years ago. I now have a '49 beetle that looks to be a border patrol car. Originally grey from the factory but then painted Ral6012 black green. Fitted with searchlights and sirens.
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JPW
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   2/12/2015, 22:12

iwlego

Missed your last set of photographs, congratulations on a job very done, the end product is magnificent.

Sinclair
Any chance of you posting a photo of your "Beetle"?
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Shelldrake
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   3/12/2015, 08:47

[quote="JPW"]iwlego

Missed your last set of photographs



And me, fantastic restoration job. Any problems with the exhaust emissions? Suspect Suspect
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Goldmohur
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PostSubject: Re: Help needed for restoration of BAOR VW beetle from 1948   4/12/2015, 15:16

A real blast from the past. Well done.
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