Army Vehicles - 1960s

what about having to empty the radiators in the winter , and filling them up wiv water next morning ,. and removing the rotor arm so no bugger pinched it , cant imagine todays lads mucking about like that , ginger

Gingerjim,
The same routine was applied to our vehicles in in Korea. The only difference was that almost neat glycol was standing by to pour into the radiators for when there was a move to the Kansas Lines (Quicktrain in BAOR)

gingerjim wrote:

what about having to empty the radiators in the winter ..... ,  ginger

_____________________________________________________________________

And removing batteries on really cold nights in camp, or running engines for ten minutes every two hours out in the woods. Before the economic miracle and an injection of more dollars into the kitty, the German infrastructure could be lethal, even in summer. Some main roads in the 1950's, the equivalent of Brit. A-Class, were sometimes only tarmac on half the width of the carriageway, the rest and often roads through small built up areas were just compacted earth. The tarmac strip was steeply cambered and shiny, exciting when there was rain or frost. The tarmac half wandered from one side to the other, all traffic drove on it whether it was coming or going. When it was on the right side of the road, traffic on it had priority, the opposition had to move over on to the earth.

I was proceeding along a straight stretch of road when a stationary tree hit me ..

Len (Ciphers)

But, did the despatch get through Len.

and it was blinking cold in germany in the 50s if i remember we had to use chains on the tyres , ginger

Cold Gingerjim but not as cold as in Korea

Jimsigs, Most of the SDS drivers were KIWI .. bloody crazy drivers .. probably due to augmenting their regular supply of booze by rendering down boot polish and drinking the residue.

Len (Ciphers)

jimsigs1 wrote:

Cartav,

Also remember cleaning the vehicles with diesel on top of the very green paintwork.

Not having access to diesel in the days of Bronze Green paint, we used to mix petrol & oil in a big can, scrub the veh with it then wipe it off with cotton waste.

gingerjim wrote:

what about having to empty the radiators in the winter , and filling them up wiv water next morning ,. and removing the rotor arm  so no bugger pinched it , cant imagine todays lads mucking about like that  ,  ginger

I remember the cooling systems being drained too.
In later times there used to be a large bottle of anti-freeze mixture on a shelf outside the guardroom that had to be watched by the gate sentry. If the mixture started to freeze a standby driver was summoned and he'd start all the gun tractors up.
Clearly the powers-that-were had no idea how anti-freeze worked!
There had to be a white square, with a red circle inside it, painted on all the veh radiator header tanks too. Can anybody recall its purpose ?

Brum,the purpose of the white square with red circle inside it was to indicate that the radiator had anti-freeze in it,and it had to be checked monthly during winter to make sure in was up to the required strengh ,which had to be done with an hydometer,if you knew how to read it. This was in practice in 1959 when i was at RHYL same time as you were up there...
The practice of using diesel to clean trucks was a everyday job with 47 gw regt as we had so many chimneys belting out filth,that every morning they had to be cleaned,bloody boring job..
MICK...

Hey Len, your right. Those bloody KIWI drivers are mad. I remember when we got out there, they met us at the train station (cant remember if is was Seoul or Tok Chong Railhead picking us up in these RL Bedford trucks and driving like hell through Gloucester Valley to our final destination - 29 Bde at the side of Kamasan.

jimsigs1 wrote:

Cold Gingerjim but not as cold as in Korea

My uncle Len was in korea with the South Staffs, he (And many others) nearly froze to death. I tried to speak to him about his experiences in Korea once or twice, all he would say was 'bloody cold' he would never expanded on that. I know he had a bad time, quite sad that these days few people know about Korea, and I suspect even fewer care. At one time the majority of people respected old soldiers, that's not the case today.

Here you go Wilf, for your uncle ..

Len (Ciphers)

Korea, a Place in Time


If you wear the "butchers apron" then you’re my kind of guy,
for you were in Korea when the bullets began to fly,
we were called to the land of the Morning Calm in 1951,
to help put out a fire the North Korean's had begun.

We landed down in Pusan and started trekking north,
as we reached the Yalu River we thought we had shown our worth,
when without a moments warning a raging blizzard blew,
and pushed hard by the Chinese, we fell back on Wonju.

Fighting hard to keep a line along the River Han,
when the pride of every regiment that is part of every man,
shone forth amongst the Gloster's, as at the Imjim they made their stand.

Their valour was infectious, and right across the land,
the tide of war was turning, the push northward was at hand.
The Yanks hit them from seaward at a place known as Inchon,
as the Chinese sensing a defeat, started peace talks at Panmunjom.

From Pork Chop Hill to Wonsan, from Seoul to Taegu,
the UN troops were pushing north, under a banner of blue,
the First Commonwealth Division, fought and held their ground,
as the talks at Panmunjom went another round.

The talking finally over, an armistice agreed,
from the 38th southward, the country had been freed,
three bitter years of fighting over that poor battered land,
will be swallowed and forgotten by natures healing hand.

We said goodbye to all our friends, and left for home with speed,
or to take up arms in other lands where there was a need,
but now as I grow older and wiser with the years,
I reflect was it worth the friends we left there, and their loved ones tears.


a place to forget
Len Payne

Great Ode to Korea Len. Got my Butchers Apron but lucky for me, got out there too late for any fighting so I feel a slight imposter etc. Got a couple of good books in my little library on Korea. The 1st Commonwealth Division by Barclay, The Korean War by Sir Max Hastings and another called The Forgotten War - Korea.

Same as me Jim, joined up in '51 to get into the 'scrap', figured it was my turn ... ended up in Germany not Korea until the fighting had stopped. It was a posting I would not have missed.
A good book to read on Korea is one called 'Now thrive the armorers', but can't recall who wrote it.

Len (Ciphers)

suffolk lad wrote:

Brum,the purpose of the white square with red circle inside it was to indicate that the radiator had anti-freeze in it,and it had to be checked monthly during winter to make sure in was up to the required strengh ,which had to be done with an hydometer,if you knew how to read it. This was in practice in 1959 when i was at RHYL same time as you were up there...
                                                                                                               MICK...

Thanks Mick I knew the symbol meant one or the other but my memory lets me down sometimes ! (I remember those hydrometers though, in a big brown box).

Hi Len,
Happy New Year to you and all the other fellow BAOR'ers.
The book you are referring to Len 'Now thrive the Armourers' is by Robert O Holles. I've seen one on Amazon for £1.75 (paperback used) Going to get it
Jim

Just a point of clarification Jim,the Sgt Payne in the book is not me .. lol

Len (Ciphers)

Len,
Was the Sgt Payne a goodie or baddie ? Didn't go for the paperback as it was from USA and was tatty. Went for a used hardback in good condition from UK - cost £7.85. Can't wait for it to arrive.
We had a Major Bearne in the Glosters at AAS Harrogate. Also, a great friend of mine was with Colonel Carne VC when they surrendered. His name LCpl Henry Jennings retired as Capt (QM). He features in that famous painting of Jennings knocking hell out of the radio with his rifle, the batman burning the sensitive paperwork and Col Carne packing up ready to evacuate. Think the original painting is in the Officers mess in Blandford.

Sgt Payne was a definite 'goodie' as were all Sergeants who bore that name.

Len (Ciphers)

I don't doubt it Len.

The many Bluebell contributors to this site will happily endorse Ciphers remarks

Robert Holles was one of the senior Battalion Armourers at the time of the Imjin River Battle and was capbadged REME when he retired from the Regular Army.

Interesting about Robert Holles, JPW. He unfortunately died in 1999 aged 73. I see from the internet that he was also a film and TV writer and amongst one of his film scripts was his work on the film 'Guns at Batasi'. You may remember the portrayal of a RSM by Richard Attenborough. Great Film. Robert father was a Sergeant Major anyway.
jimsigs

ciphers wrote:

Here you go Wilf, for your uncle ..

Len (Ciphers)

Korea, a Place in Time


If you wear the "butchers apron" then you’re my kind of guy,
for you were in Korea when the bullets began to fly,
we were called to the land of the Morning Calm in 1951,
to help put out a fire the North Korean's had begun.

We landed down in Pusan and started trekking north,
as we reached the Yalu River we thought we had shown our worth,
when without a moments warning a raging blizzard blew,
and pushed hard by the Chinese, we fell back on Wonju.

Fighting hard to keep a line along the River Han,
when the pride of every regiment that is part of every man,
shone forth amongst the Gloster's, as at the Imjim they made their stand.

Their valour was infectious, and right across the land,
the tide of war was turning, the push northward was at hand.
The Yanks hit them from seaward at a place known as Inchon,
as the Chinese sensing a defeat, started peace talks at Panmunjom.

From Pork Chop Hill to Wonsan, from Seoul to Taegu,
the UN troops were pushing north, under a banner of blue,
the First Commonwealth Division, fought and held their ground,
as the talks at Panmunjom went another round.

The talking finally over, an armistice agreed,
from the 38th southward, the country had been freed,
three bitter years of fighting over that poor battered land,
will be swallowed and forgotten by natures healing hand.

We said goodbye to all our friends, and left for home with speed,
or to take up arms in other lands where there was a need,
but now as I grow older and wiser with the years,
I reflect was it worth the friends we left there, and their loved ones tears.


a place to forget
Len Payne

Quite a moving poem Len, very poignant. If my uncle Len were alive today I'm sure it would take him to a place he would sooner forget, which is fine, as long as history never forgets.