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 Something to give away

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AuthorMessage
Hardrations
Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime14/4/2010, 22:01

Been going through my accumulated military crud and came across two MORFED 1965KF6314 tin openers. They have the British arrow stamp on them. Any body want these? Send me your snail mail address and they're yours. No charge. Just another useless item to drive your partner battier. Oh yes one is copper coated and one is plain aluminium I believe.
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Stephen Lock
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Stephen Lock

Number of posts : 937
Age : 66
Localisation : Calgary
Cap Badge : Pads Brat
Places Served : Father -- Canadian Army. Served Hemer, Soest, and Wetter
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime15/4/2010, 07:00

Useless??? Naaah.....you can open tins with them!

They can be used in the kitchen or on camping trips. Barbeques (what a great conversation piece, uh?). Useless...pfffft....

Smile Smile
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oldtimer
WOII
WOII
oldtimer

Number of posts : 99
Age : 72
Localisation : Manchester
Cap Badge : RCT
Places Served : Yeovil, Bunde, Lubbecke,camp du larzac, norway,rct winter training centre hinterstien, Aldershot,
Registration date : 2009-09-22

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime15/4/2010, 08:59

you can still buy them today came across them in a camping shop when looking for stuff i could use but would pack small for long motorcycle trips made by a company in wales,but i have a p 51 that is the same but an american version they claim to have invented, its identical to the british MORFED ? so who did invent it. but my favorite bit of kit is a survival kit in a can see link.

http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/tools/a396/

good job i am a widower with all my rubbish('Laughing')
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime15/4/2010, 15:38

Mine reads

129-9982 MORFED /|\ 1979

(129-9982 being the last 7 of the 13 digit NATP stock Number)

and is plain aluminium
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Hardrations
Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime15/4/2010, 16:30

Well somebody is looking for it. So they are off in the mail. Apparently he bought one in a camping supply store. Found it useless. What got me though, on this tiny item was that it had the broad arrow stamp. I have the feeling I've started a new conversation on bits and pieces.
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

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PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime15/4/2010, 16:37

These Can Openers were issued in the British 4 & 10 Man Tinned Ration Packs as well as the old tinned 24 Hour ration pack (COMPO)
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Hardrations
Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime15/4/2010, 17:42

Mike_2817 wrote:
These Can Openers were issued in the British 4 & 10 Man Tinned Ration Packs as well as the old tinned 24 Hour ration pack (COMPO)

No doubt about that Mike. I'd have to have gotten them from them. Geeze I've been dragging them around since the early 60's. Go figure. But they are on their way to a mad scotsman.
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Teabag
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Teabag

Number of posts : 960
Age : 69
Localisation : Merseyside
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Wildenrath Detmold
Registration date : 2008-10-30

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime15/4/2010, 20:41

Have carried mine in my wallet for thirty something years and yes I have been asked if "anyone has got a tin opener" and gleefully replied yep, try this. Usually followed by "er how does it work?". Looks of genuine amazement when you show them. Clever little gadget!
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Stephen Lock
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Stephen Lock

Number of posts : 937
Age : 66
Localisation : Calgary
Cap Badge : Pads Brat
Places Served : Father -- Canadian Army. Served Hemer, Soest, and Wetter
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime16/4/2010, 07:00

oldtimer wrote:
you can still buy them today came across them in a camping shop when looking for stuff i could use but would pack small for long motorcycle trips made by a company in wales,but i have a p 51 that is the same but an american version they claim to have invented, its identical to the british MORFED ? so who did invent it. but my favorite bit of kit is a survival kit in a can see link.

http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/tools/a396/

good job i am a widower with all my rubbish('Laughing')

You do know, of course, the Americans claim to have invented all sorts of things others invented....the telephone, for instance (Alexander Graham Bell....Canadian). The telegraph (Canadian-British). Hockey...well, duh!! Canadian by way of Scots. Wouldn't surprise me if they now claimed to have invented curling (as in sport, not as in hair LOL...but that too!).

Kind of like how they claim never to have lost a war prior to Vietnam (and even there, that was a withdrawal of troops...a political decision, you know, NOT a defeat!) yet we (Canadians) whupped their butts during the War of 1812 and even got as far as Washington and burned the White House and they also claim they won WWII. uh-huh....
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oldtimer
WOII
WOII
oldtimer

Number of posts : 99
Age : 72
Localisation : Manchester
Cap Badge : RCT
Places Served : Yeovil, Bunde, Lubbecke,camp du larzac, norway,rct winter training centre hinterstien, Aldershot,
Registration date : 2009-09-22

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime16/4/2010, 16:03

it seems not only the americans have a good imagination ?

alexander graham bell canadian? born March 3, 1847
Edinburgh, Scotland, UK Laughing nice try stephen

The history of invention in Canada has followed a long and noble path. Canadian inventors have patented more than one million inventions, yet few people can name more than one or two Canadian inventors or any Canadian accomplishments. not surprised few people can name more than one or two even the ones they mention on the site great canadian inventions seem to have been born else where and emigrated to canada
so maybe that is canadas claim to fame that some great inventors emigrated there pity albert einstien went to the states and not canada you could have claimed him as well. Laughing

if any country has a claim to some of the worlds greatest inventions it has to be scotland thank god its part of the uk, anyway got to go now something on tv i want to watch (thank you john logie bear born scotland).

sorry stephen just in a odd mood today. Wink
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brum
FM
FM


Number of posts : 2808
Age : 78
Localisation : Sandbach Cheshire
Cap Badge : RA/QOH
Places Served : JLRRA (Hereford) Nienburg Paderborn Colchester Munster Maresfield (Cyprus) Hohne Hemer Op Banner x4 Woolwich
Registration date : 2010-03-02

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime16/4/2010, 20:23

Er, hang on a minute there oldtimer. Are you saying that Yogi Bear invented the TV?
But Yogi Bear's a Yank ain't he?
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Teabag
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Teabag

Number of posts : 960
Age : 69
Localisation : Merseyside
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Wildenrath Detmold
Registration date : 2008-10-30

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime16/4/2010, 22:10

brum wrote:
Er, hang on a minute there oldtimer. Are you saying that Yogi Bear invented the TV?
But Yogi Bear's a Yank ain't he?

Well he is smarter than the average bear!
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Stephen Lock
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Stephen Lock

Number of posts : 937
Age : 66
Localisation : Calgary
Cap Badge : Pads Brat
Places Served : Father -- Canadian Army. Served Hemer, Soest, and Wetter
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 08:56

oldtimer wrote:
it seems not only the americans have a good imagination ?

alexander graham bell canadian? born March 3, 1847
Edinburgh, Scotland, UK Laughing nice try stephen

Yes, I was aware Alexander Graham Bell was born Scots but he emigrated to Canada (Brantford, Ontario) where he did considerable work with the deaf and studied sound and sound technology, eventually leading to the invention of what we know as the telephone (which, by the way, he despised and refused to own one!). So, ethnically he was a Scot --like many early Canadians -- but he was residing in Canada. Ergo, the telephone is a "Canadian" invention.

So, how did the Americans lay claim? Well, AGB also taught at a school for the deaf in Boston during the period he was working on and eventually perfected his telephone...but, arguably, the majority of the work he did on this and other sound technologies was at his home in Ontario.

oldtimer wrote:
The history of invention in Canada has followed a long and noble path. Canadian inventors have patented more than one million inventions, yet few people can name more than one or two Canadian inventors or any Canadian accomplishments. not surprised few people can name more than one or two even the ones they mention on the site great canadian inventions seem to have been born else where and emigrated to canada
so maybe that is canadas claim to fame that some great inventors emigrated there

True, but since Canada is a country created on immigration (unless one is First Nations...but they "emigrated" from Siberia and Northeast Asia across the Bering Strait a few millennia ago so it can be argued North American Indians/First Nations are "just" immigrants with a longer time here ) everybody's ancestors came from some where else and the earliest non-aboriginal immigrants were French, Scots, English, Irish and Welsh.

We Canadians are a modest bunch, by and large, and continue the reticence of our Gaelic/Anglo-Saxon forebears and just don't go around bragging about "our" inventions.



oldtimer wrote:
pity albert einstien went to the states and not canada you could have claimed him as well. Laughing

If he had emigrated to Canada, then I would have! Because then he would have been a Canadian, wouldn't he? Wink

Once an individual emigrates from their homeland, be it Scotland or elsewhere, and immigrates to Canada then their accomplishments cease to be attributable to their country of origin and become "Canadian" (or which ever country they emigrate to)



oldtimer wrote:
if any country has a claim to some of the worlds greatest inventions it has to be scotland thank god its part of the uk, anyway got to go now something on tv i want to watch (thank you john logie bear born scotland).

sorry stephen just in a odd mood today.


So it seems.... geek

"..claim to some of the world's greatest inventions..."? Hmmmm...bagpipes, kilts, haggis, and golf? :LOL:
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Hardrations
Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 14:55

Back on subject:

Who invented the MORFED 1965KF6314 tin openers?
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 15:50

A French confectioner named Nicolas Appert, who had discovered that heating food to high temperatures inside sealed glass jars stopped it from ‘going off’. It was over half a century later that scientists discovered that the heat used in the canning process kills the micro-organisms which cause food to decay.

The British first developed 'canned food' for the Royal Navy and Antarctic Expeditions as glass jars broke to easily particularly in very cold climates, but the Can opener seems to be a later invention! as at first a hammer & chisal was used to open them.

I do not know who invented the 'Mini Can Opener', but the British 'Compo' Can Opener is based on the U.S. Army P38 (Pattern 38) Can Opener provided with K Rations during WWII. Later replaced with a larger P51 version for C Rations.

P51's are no longer used for individual rations by the United States Armed Forces, as canned C-rations were replaced by uncanned MREs in the 1980s. They are, however, included with US military "Tray Rations" (canned bulk meals). They are also still seen in disaster recovery efforts and have been handed out alongside canned food by rescue organizations, such as UNHCR both in America and abroad.

It is no longer packed in British 10 Man Operational Ration Ration Packs (Tinned Food for centrol feeding) and 'boil in the bag' made it no longer needed in our 24 Hour Field Ration Packs either.

Something to give away 220px-P-openers
US P51 with earler (smaller) P38 Can Opener
[Main differance is we moved the hole to the other end of our 'P38' Opener]

A similar device that incorporates a small spoon at one end and a bottle opener at the other is currently employed by the Australian Defence Force and New Zealand Army in its ration kits. The Field Ration Eating Device is known by the acronym "FRED". It is also known widely in its derogative term, the "F**king Ridiculous Eating Device".

Something to give away 220px-ADF_Can_Opener


Last edited by Mike_2817 on 17/4/2010, 16:24; edited 3 times in total
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oldtimer
WOII
WOII
oldtimer

Number of posts : 99
Age : 72
Localisation : Manchester
Cap Badge : RCT
Places Served : Yeovil, Bunde, Lubbecke,camp du larzac, norway,rct winter training centre hinterstien, Aldershot,
Registration date : 2009-09-22

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PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 15:59

i dont know who invented them but they were made by Morfed (S. Wales) Ltd., Caerphilly. according to the guy in the camp shop but he says he cant get them any more thats why i bought the p51 as mentioned in earlier post,like mike says the p51 is slightly bigger but great for not only opening cans but as a screwdriver it said on the pack but have to take there word for that.

the company is still going and based in caerphilly according to the company register.
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

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PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 16:20

Yes 'oldtimer' I have also seen P51's for sale in camping shops and as you say the MORFED version is no longer made, more the pity.

The latest dated one I have seen was 1985

When I was in the Army we carried 2 openers in total.

A Compo Can Opener & a 'Church Key' (Bottle Opener)

Of course a issue 'Jack Knife' did both jobs anyway, but cost more to replace if you lost it!
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Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

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PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 18:32

Aa ha.. That explains a bit. I have a P51 some where in my accumalted junk.

Incidentaly, I think the Franklin expidition to the north was found to be suffering from lead poison because of lead solder being used on the tin cans.
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: TEST   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 20:56

Yes, however it was later suspected that it was the ships lead water tank that was to blame! But lead solder was used on early cans, so it may also have contributed.
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Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 21:48

Mike_2817 wrote:
Yes, however it was later suspected that it was the ships lead water tank that was to blame! But lead solder was used on early cans, so it may also have contributed.

Hey.... I didn't know about the water tank. That would be a major contributor.
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brum
FM
FM


Number of posts : 2808
Age : 78
Localisation : Sandbach Cheshire
Cap Badge : RA/QOH
Places Served : JLRRA (Hereford) Nienburg Paderborn Colchester Munster Maresfield (Cyprus) Hohne Hemer Op Banner x4 Woolwich
Registration date : 2010-03-02

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PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 21:48

I'm not sure how we made the quantum leap from can openers to lead poisoning ! But I remember seeing a TV programme a couple of years ago where bodies from, (I think), the Franklin expedition were dug up from the permafrost and a post-mortem determined that the lead solder on their ration cans had poisoned them.
This folding can opener that, in the early 60's, we jokingly called the KF6314 used to come in a little package that also contained that peculiarly British-" Paper, Toilet, Shiny". Why we were issued with a toilet paper that left a brown streak halfway up our back I'll never understand but please, let us not let this subject drift on to "Boxes, Thunder"!
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Hardrations
Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 21:53

There was a shiny side for using as per instruction and the ruough side for striking matches. Wasn't it?
Something to give away Icon_eek
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brum
FM
FM


Number of posts : 2808
Age : 78
Localisation : Sandbach Cheshire
Cap Badge : RA/QOH
Places Served : JLRRA (Hereford) Nienburg Paderborn Colchester Munster Maresfield (Cyprus) Hohne Hemer Op Banner x4 Woolwich
Registration date : 2010-03-02

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 22:03

Christ! Ours was shiny both sides.
No wonder you Canucks are so tough!
This could be getting back to the "Burning Ring of Fire"
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Hardrations
Let Gen
Let Gen
Hardrations

Number of posts : 1045
Localisation : Winnipeg Manitoba Canada
Cap Badge : RC Sigs (RTG Op) / CF Logistics (Cook)
Places Served : Germany, Egypt, Cyprus, CFS Alert and some other strange places
Registration date : 2007-12-16

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 22:32

I'm sure that's what was issued to us in BOAR.
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Mike_2817
LE Maj
LE Maj
Mike_2817

Number of posts : 643
Localisation : North Yorkshire
Cap Badge : RAOC
Registration date : 2009-08-27

Something to give away Empty
PostSubject: Re: Something to give away   Something to give away Icon_minitime17/4/2010, 23:14

brum wrote:
I'm not sure how we made the quantum leap from can openers to lead poisoning ! But I remember seeing a TV programme a couple of years ago where bodies from, (I think), the Franklin expedition were dug up from the permafrost and a post-mortem determined that the lead solder on their ration cans had poisoned them.
This folding can opener that, in the early 60's, we jokingly called the KF6314 used to come in a little package that also contained that peculiarly British-" Paper, Toilet, Shiny". Why we were issued with a toilet paper that left a brown streak halfway up our back I'll never understand but please, let us not let this subject drift on to "Boxes, Thunder"!

Not difficult to stray from Can Openers to Canned Food Brum!

A 1980's study suggested they most likely died of pneumonia and perhaps tuberculosis and that lead poisoning may have worsened their health, owing to badly-soldered cans held in the ships' food stores.

However, it was later suggested that the more likley source of this lead may not have been tinned food, but the distilled water system fitted to the expedition’s ships just before they sailed, which were not a standard RN fit.

A very detailed analysis is included in this report, if you are interested:

http://www.hakluyt.com/PDF/Battersby_Franklin.pdf

Had it been Lead Piosoning from Cans it would have effected many other RN Ships as well, but it did not.


Last edited by Mike_2817 on 17/4/2010, 23:37; edited 1 time in total
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