End of an era

Quote :

British troopers arrived in Germany as liberators in 1945, and stayed as part of Nato after the division of the country. Now they are to leave by 2010

That really is the end of an era then. I'm sad about this, but logically, why are we there these days.

[b]Link Here

2010?? That dosn`t give them very long to get out.

Try 2020 Jim

Gordon. wrote:

2010?? That dosn`t give them very long to get out.

Try 2020 Jim

Oh yeah ?

Just shout "end of exercise", that'll shift 'em !

It is very sad. I arrived in Sennelager in early 79. I was 18. I had a great time and I 'grew up' in Germany. All in all I served there five times, which included my last tour. I applied for one or two civil service jobs over there after my time was up, purely on the basis that they would get me back to Germany. The money was rubbish, even with the perks, but as those jobs were 'already spoken for', that's all of an irrelevance now. I truly miss the place and if my circumstances were different, I'd have been back there living on the local economy. I never thought, until recently, that I'd see the final date being set, but there you go. It's a done deal. There are hundreds of thousands of us who all served there and who have great memories of the places we served, the people we met, the bars we drank in and even the exercises we partook in. It has been sad to see the gradual reduction in the number of Garrisons over the years, but with the final curtain being set to lower, it adds a certain emotional element to it. Certainty. What a dreadful vision.

If I had my life all over again, I would do it all over again. So would you! I'm glad that BAOR/BFG happened in my lifetime or should I say, I happened in its lifetime!

Right on Rocky. My 4 years with 4 CIBG was one of my best tours in the Canadian Army. My 3 years in Lahr were okay but could not compare to my BAOR tour. I truly felt to be part of a real army.

I nearly married a German girl, If I had I'm sure I'd be living there now.

I totally agree with Rocky. But remember chaps, this is why this site is here. The forum is to talk about old times and memories - some happy, some sad and some you just couldn't make up! But don't forget the main site. This is where all of those memories should be written down so that they are not lost. Long after us old sods have disappeared there should be a record of what BAOR/BFG was and what it meant to an awful lot of people. So get those memories and photo's in. Keep the faith!

Placing myself in the ranks of the even older sods, I also agree with the various sentiments expressed, although I'm inclined to think that some of the contributors have been customers of Specsavers and have invested in a pair of rose-tinted spectacles !

I've tried at least four times to "get those memories and photos in", Chris but sadly, my attempts have been ignored.

No Booker prize for me then !

I'm not going to pretend I know why you have had no luck, Brum. I personally have entered everything I have been sent by anybody. My inbox is completely empty so I know it is all on the site. If you fancy another go at some time, then send them to me and I guarantee to put them on the site. Then you'll be up for the Booker!!

73-83 and 89-91,great times,great mates wouldnt swap it for the world...graham..

Not unexpected, had to happen eventually but, sad nonetheless. I first went to BAOR as a "brat" in 46/47 and apart from 3 years in Austria and a year in the UK spent all my childhood there until I joined up in 1960. I probably have more memories of Germany than anywhere else I've lived.

It is sad that it is going to happen but the RAF Bases we had are all gone and have been for a while and when they went, i knew it would not be long before the pongo's would move out sooner or later.
As you all say, great times etc and i for one will always remember the countryside around RAF Wildenrath etc and Berlin was the dogs bits of a posting. So much history in and around Berlin and i for one will always remember goerings old house, carinhall, just north of Berlin and the seelow heights too the east. In 1992, some RAF copper mates and myself went there and we were all gob smacked by all the rusty helmets and rusty wepons lying around the battlefield ! The east germans never bothered to clear them !

I feel sorry for the army leaving Germany and moving back here, because RAF Kinloss is shutting down and i feel sorry for the army if they have to move in there !
Its a dump !

JAL wrote:

Not unexpected, had to happen eventually but, sad nonetheless. I first went to BAOR as a "brat" in 46/47 and apart from 3 years in Austria and a year in the UK spent all my childhood there until I joined up in 1960. I probably have more memories of Germany than anywhere else I've lived.

Yes, same here mate. I grew up in Germany and probably feel more at home there than I do here in England in a way.

Rocky wrote:

It is very sad. I arrived in Sennelager in early 79. I was 18. I had a great time and I 'grew up' in Germany. All in all I served there five times, which included my last tour. I applied for one or two civil service jobs over there after my time was up, purely on the basis that they would get me back to Germany. The money was rubbish, even with the perks, but as those jobs were 'already spoken for', that's all of an irrelevance now. I truly miss the place and if my circumstances were different, I'd have been back there living on the local economy. I never thought, until recently, that I'd see the final date being set, but there you go. It's a done deal. There are hundreds of thousands of us who all served there and who have great memories of the places we served, the people we met, the bars we drank in and even the exercises we partook in. It has been sad to see the gradual reduction in the number of Garrisons over the years, but with the final curtain being set to lower, it adds a certain emotional element to it. Certainty. What a dreadful vision.

If I had my life all over again, I would do it all over again. So would you! I'm glad that BAOR/BFG happened in my lifetime or should I say, I happened in its lifetime!

A good post Rocky and I agree totally, it'll be a sad sad time when we finally pull out for good. I've spent the last 15 years of my Army career over here and am hanging on for as long as possible, my kids were born here and have never lived in the UK plus the wife doesn't want to leave either.

We only wish we could settle over here and work on the German net but can't see it happening unfortunately.

I grew up in Germany, man and child and live in the UK but do miss Germany - hey, we should get a get together, fly to Germany for a weekend and re-live our German times!!!

I was born in Germany, Served in BAOR 1972-75 and 1977-79 and visited almost evey year on exersise till 1986 then a few times till retiring in 1993. Not been back since. But yes I do miss the comradery of a good unit which I was alway lucky to have been a part of, who worked hard and played even harder when off duty. It would not be the same for me to visit now.

Themaadone wrote:

I grew up in Germany, man and child and live in the UK but do miss Germany - hey, we should get a get together, fly to Germany for a weekend and re-live our German times!!!

Re-live our German times. For sure I'll be coming home in a pine box. I should have many times in the past.

PS: Mr Moderator can you do something about my count. I'm staying at 384?

You are showing 387 to me!!!

It`s an age thing

Suppose the Germans could start another war and then we get to occupy them again once we win?

You get to keep it after three times don't you or is that the world cup?

I reluctantly returned to Canada after several years between 1957 and 65. Took my discharge as the future of the Canadian Army didn't look all that great, plus my new wife didn't find army life to her liking. Anyway I sure missed my time there and swore I would go back for a holiday.

That was 45 years ago and I still haven't made it. While I look back on those BAOR years fondly*, a voice inside reminds me that you can't go home again. I suspect that after nearly a half century (MY GOD, TEMPUS FUGIT!!!) I would find that all too true. Then I get on this forum and I think that I should make the trip after all.

In addition to my old haunts in the Soest-Werl-Hemer area, I would especially like to visit the former GDR territories. I used to look over the fence and wonder what the beer tasted like over there. Also Hereford where I downed the odd gill of Hereforder with my many friends in 7 Sigs at Schmidt's and "Companion's".

* The 4th Canadian Infantry Brigade Group was an integral part of the 4th Div although we didn't wear the quadrant div patch. In fact the GOC in the mid 60's was a Canadian Major General, Jean Allard.

Happy Days!

You've got it straight recce. I've been back, still have good friends there, but it's not the same. Your camp area's are just bush now in Werl. Still though a walk across the Mohnee See is worth it, a meal down town Soest is worth it, a rainy day looking across German fields, smelling the German earth, to hear the coo coo bird in the woods, to smell a German deli store, a Sat. morning market, maybe just to walk down streets that have hidden memories only you can understand. It's nice to know that we can banish the bad and unpleasant from the past and remember the good of that country.

Recce83

You are quite right for many years 4 CIMBG was an integral part of 4 Division with a small Canadian staff planning team integrated within the Divisional HQ in Herford

i go back on a regular basis so for me the changes have been more gradual rarther than a big shock at how things have changed,but changed they have all the camps i served in have long gone and of course the bars i spent my time in are changed beyond all recognition but i knew this would be the case, the fond memories i have of the 60s and 70s bare no resembalnce of what greets me even if its only 6 months since my last visit i expect things will have changed but thats life. yet i look forward and am all ready planning my next visit in june the only one thing i hate is the euro it might make life easier for me as i travel through france,belgium and holland but it just seems strange no d/marks. but there is no greater feeling for me than getting on the autobahn and passing all the familiar signs some still bring a smile to my face.

recce83 and Hardrations
4 Cdn Bde was part of 2 Division in earlier days picked this up from a visit to the RE museum

REgards
Steve