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 What would?

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Teabag
Maj Gen
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Teabag

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PostSubject: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 09:10

Okay so I am a bit bored but do like to help keep this brilliant site going as much as possible. So here goes.

If you could import something that the Germans do into the UK that you think is an excellent idea, what would it be?

Personally, I would like to see us adopt or readopt the policy of having a deposit on all bottles sold. Virtually everything from beer to fruit juice bottles have a deposit paid on them and people actually return them. As we all know, a lot of ours are recycled but millions are not and go to landfill or end up smashed/thrown away etc.

From my experience, the Germans would return a crate of bottles and buy another one. Keeps the economy turning over as well.

I would also like to see us take more responsibility for keeping the streets clean. I remember being with German friends and a lad threw a bratty carton on the floor at a local fair. Virtually everyone in the vicinity shouted at him and he sheepishly picked it up and put it in a bin.

Bulky rubbish day would be another good one. Any more?
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brum
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 09:22

As I recall, the Germans don't pay road tax. The tax goes on petrol, so-the more you use the roads the more you pay for their upkeep.

It seems wrong that I have to pay the same road tax as a 2000 miles-a-week sales rep.

I would like to see a bit of German common sense imported.
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steve
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 10:37

Good morning Brum and all
It is France who pays no road tax they have motorway tolls instead we pay in Germany did have a year free some time ago when buying a new car diesel car tax much higher than petrol but the fuel costs are lower however newer cleaner diesel engines have a reduced tax as the CO2 ratings can be lower than some petrol engines to add to Teabag's post drink cans and plastic bottles also have a deposit and most supermarkets have a machine to feed the empties in including full crates and a credit against your purchases...it is not 'rocket science' a great system
Regards
Steve
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mjm34
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 16:06

brum wrote:
As I recall, the Germans don't pay road tax. The tax goes on petrol, so-the more you use the roads the more you pay for their upkeep.

It seems wrong that I have to pay the same road tax as a 2000 miles-a-week sales rep.

I would like to see a bit of German common sense imported.

Or more to the point, why should you pay road tax when huge articulated lorries from the Continent don't pay and they are doing more damage to the roads?

Adding the tax to petrol (even though ours is amongst the highest taxed fuel in the world) would at least distribute the tax burden more fairly amongst road users, but the problem is that taxes raised from motoring just go into the general Exchequer pot and are not specifically used for road building and maintenance. Ergo they are just another way of squeezing your hard earned dosh out of you regardless of whether you actually use the roads or not.

Mike
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brum
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 17:13

Has that allways been the case Steve?
I'm going back to the 70's on this one. The way the Germans paid their road tax was a commonly held belief amongst us "zwanzig liter Super, bitte" motorists.

How about this one then?
On one of our "Banner" tours, a senior rank of ours got a letter, all in German, saying that his son had run into the road and a spotty Herbert on a moped (aaah, those mopeds eh?) had damaged his machine while avoiding said child.
Sarge said that this was not cricket as he wasn't even in bally Germany, so how could he be blamed? German law said that he was responsible for raising his child in such a way that he does not run into the road without looking. Pay the fine, or go to court and pay even more.
Remorseless logic.
I still say, import German common sense !

brum
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ChrisP
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 18:49

I think the German sense of 'Family' would be good to import. You have children and you are responsible for them until they leave home. They do not belong to Social Services or the state, they belong to you. Until they are old enough (not sure what age?) you take responsiblity for them. When I was out there the parents even had to take out insurance for their kids to pay for any damage they might do!
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Mikey
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 21:36

Makes sense Brum can't knock the logic, your kids your responsibility we need more of that logic over here!
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Mike_2817
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 22:52

At Sennelarger in the late 70's I lived in a Private Hiring above the AldiMart, and almost opposite was an un-manned railway crossing. One weekend a young lad out cycling got killed by a train, and the British service family were devastated to say the least, only to receive a legal letter in German saying the train driver was suing them for lack of child supervision & neglect, and a passing witness for compensation for blood on her cloths and nightmares!

It seems that this ambulance chasing litigation has actually reached the UK already! but not to the fine art the Germans had it to....

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Mike_2817
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime31/5/2010, 22:59

Is not the German Road Tax a sticker on the licence plate, together with insurance and which changes every year?

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Hardrations
Let Gen
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime1/6/2010, 04:45

Some body's gotta put this one in.

What about a genuine Schniel Imbiss. Curry wurst and palm fritz mit mayonnaise...
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Stephen Lock
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime1/6/2010, 05:40

The deposit on bottles and such makes perfect sense. I'd forgotten about the ability to return an entire crate of beer bottles and of course your friendly neighbourhood gasthof always had stacks of crates out back.

Here in the fair Dominion of Canada (and that dates me...nobody knows we are a "Dominion" anymore. But that's a whole other thread!) we have had can and bottle deposits for some time. One still sees empty pop cans about, of course, but we also have bottle-pickers (homeless guys, usually) who make their daily bread (or wine) by collecting them and trotting them off to the local bottle depot. Dedicated recyclers as well, which makes for an interesting mix of people on a Saturday morning down at the depot...soccer moms with their collection of wine bottles and micro-brewery beer bottles and pop cans, rummies pushing their shopping carts with large garbage bags filled with empties, and the local Scout troop or Guides or church youth with their collection from the neighbourhood all converging on the depot to get their refunds! We recently introduced deposits on plastic milk cartons as well, which I think is a great idea.

The sense of cleanliness is something I miss. I have fond memories of some little old frau out in front of her house with a bucket and hard wire long-handled brush and hot sudsy water scrubbing down the cobblestones in front of her door, just as her neighbour did, and their neighbour and so on and so on. We certainly don't see that here!

The tradition of taking a walk through the woods on a Sunday was a nice tradition. Here few people do that. It's either a fullout hike, which is a bit extreme for most of us, or jogging but few bother to take a nice leisurely 2-3 hour stroll anywhere.

What I'd like to see transported to my city is the idea of being able to sit out on a nice deck, with a great view of the street life or the hills or the river or what-have-you, and have a civilized beer. Not some rowdy patio attached to a bar...we have those. But rather a nice mom-and-pop type establishment with the Cilantro umbrellas, serving nice light snacks maybe and beer like one sees all over Germany. No one sits there all afternoon and gets blotto (which is likely what would happen here...sigh...); that's not the idea at all. The idea is to have a beer or two to go with the comfortable, social, taking-in-the-view mentality not to have the view go with your beer. There's a whole different cause and effect thing going on. Here we have it bassackwards, IMHO.

In Germany, it would not be unusual at all to see families at such patios...unheard of, and illegal, here. Can't have minors in a licensed establishment and forget about having your dog lie quietly under the table...wouldn't be allowed at all here!

The other thing I'd like to see is Konditorei here....those wonderful tea and coffee parlours attached to a bakery. Totally civilized environments!
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steve
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime1/6/2010, 06:29

[quote="brum"]Has that allways been the case Steve?
I'm going back to the 70's on this one. The way the Germans paid their road tax was a commonly held belief amongst us "zwanzig liter Super, bitte" motorists.

Road tax has been going since just after WW2

Mike_2817 wrote:
Is not the German Road Tax a sticker on the licence plate, together with insurance and which changes every year?

The sticker is the TÜV (MOT) test that is valid for two years you receive a bill each year for your road tax and if you do not pay a 'little man' comes round and scraps of the stickers your insurance is not connected to the sticker but if you do not pay the insurance company let the 'little man' know and he comes round and your stickers come off season plates are available for the summer or winter only registration with the months embossed in the plate great if you a bike or camper you only want to use in the summer
Cheers
Steve
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Teabag
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime1/6/2010, 10:40

Am I remembering correctly, aren't Germans responsible for the pavement at the front of their houses as well?

Wish they were here because some of them don't know what a brush looks like and as for scrubbing it down, well forget it. Not my dog shit so why should I worry?

Think I will dash off an email or letter to the powers that be suggesting that deposit bottles/cans/milk cartons should be introduced. Do you reckon the drink and bottle lobby would allow it? Doubt it somehow! Who in Government is responsible?
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Mike_2817
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime1/6/2010, 12:12

steve wrote:


Mike_2817 wrote:
Is not the German Road Tax a sticker on the licence plate, together with insurance and which changes every year?

The sticker is the TÜV (MOT) test that is valid for two years you receive a bill each year for your road tax and if you do not pay a 'little man' comes round and scraps of the stickers your insurance is not connected to the sticker but if you do not pay the insurance company let the 'little man' know and he comes round and your stickers come off season plates are available for the summer or winter only registration with the months embossed in the plate great if you a bike or camper you only want to use in the summer
Cheers
Steve

So I was half right then! They are connected.

In Southern Ireland (Eire) they have a Road Tax Disk same as the UK but also an Insurance Certificate that sits above it in the windscreen to show you have paid, and between them indicate the vehicale is MOT'd as well.

Germany also had (have) a tax sticker on your rubbish bin as well, which was why most had the smallest possible!

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Rocky
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime1/6/2010, 18:38

I think I'd like to see the whole social attitude imported from Germany to the UK. OK, in the larger German cities where there are large pockets of immigrants, it may have been diluted, but in the Garrison towns there was still that wholesale responsibility thing going on. The rules applied to all and sundry. I'm sick to death of the selfish, pig ignorant, obnoxious, 'the rules apply to everybody else but me' attitude that we have here in the UK. In most if not all small German towns (I'll deliberately ignore the cities) the streets were clean, people respect each others property and each other (well, up until the point of transgression of the rules that is!). I hate living here, I truly do. You can't escape the sh*te in this country. It has permeated every nook and cranny. Small pockets (including some squaddies and their families) of scum make life difficult for the law abiding majority and nobody wants to rein them in, which is hardly surprising given the mouthful of abuse you receive when you interfere with 'their way of life' i.e., I'll drive as fast as I like anywhere I like and if I want to ping dog ends into my neighbours garden or allow my kids to do as they please, I bloody well will. I would move back to Germany tomorrow if I could afford the schooling for my kids. I'm sick to death of being taxed up to the ying yang to accommodate the lifestyles of these people.

Apart from all that, I'd like to see more Bratty stands!
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Stephen Lock
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime1/6/2010, 22:00

Rocky wrote:
I think I'd like to see the whole social attitude imported from Germany to the UK. OK, in the larger German cities where there are large pockets of immigrants, it may have been diluted, but in the Garrison towns there was still that wholesale responsibility thing going on. The rules applied to all and sundry. I'm sick to death of the selfish, pig ignorant, obnoxious, 'the rules apply to everybody else but me' attitude that we have here in the UK.

It's not just in UK you encounter this, Rocky, believe me! It's everywhere and especially here in N. America. I'm not sure what it stems from -- a certain sense of entitlement, certainly, but it's more than that.

I'm going to sound like some old codger ("in my day..."), but there has been an eroding of the social contract for many years. I work in retail and the level of abuse I and my co-workers endure on a daily basis is unbelievable. I almost say by rote now "Don't swear at me" as I attempt to deal with whatever issue it is some Neanderthal appears to have...usually something totally outside my control. And don't even get me started on the mess people leave behind. Absolute slop. Have these people never seen a waste bin? You know -- that big thing with a green garbage bag in it? Yeah, that thing; put your damn empty cups, straw wrappers, discarded cup lids IN THERE and not all over the *^#!! counter!

We also have dedicated parking spaces for disabled, marked by a blue sign portraying a stick figure in a wheelchair. Technically, there is a fine for abled bodied folk parking in such spots and if you do not have a permit hanging from your rearview mirror, you cannot park in that space yet many do and if you dare point out to them they have just occupied a disabled parking stall, at the very least they look at you as if you just came out with the most bizarre statement imaginable and keep on going or they hurl verbal abuse at you that would curl your hair (luckily, I don't have any to curl!!). "I'm only going to be 30 seconds, for *^#! sake!" meanwhile they're in the store for 20 minutes plus. Morons....

I even had a guy go into our walk-in cooler vault to search through the racks for whatever drink he wanted and, when asked what he was doing, swore at me and then declared "I live by my own rules, dude!" Yeah? How about you take your own rules and go somewhere else...he didn't react positively to that! I hasten to add the suggestion he go somewhere else was after I suggested he ask a staff member to assist him if what he wanted wasn't on the racks in the front and he got all huffy and told me to 'f***in' chill out".

Rocky wrote:
In most if not all small German towns (I'll deliberately ignore the cities) the streets were clean, people respect each others property and each other (well, up until the point of transgression of the rules that is!). I hate living here, I truly do. You can't escape the sh*te in this country. It has permeated every nook and cranny. Small pockets (including some squaddies and their families) of scum make life difficult for the law abiding majority and nobody wants to rein them in, which is hardly surprising given the mouthful of abuse you receive when you interfere with 'their way of life' i.e., I'll drive as fast as I like anywhere I like and if I want to ping dog ends into my neighbours garden or allow my kids to do as they please, I bloody well will. I would move back to Germany tomorrow if I could afford the schooling for my kids. I'm sick to death of being taxed up to the ying yang to accommodate the lifestyles of these people.

I concur. When I returned to Germany in 1973 to work (I was 20 and 21 at the time), my intention was to stay and not return to Canada. That didn't work out quite the way I had envisioned and I returned in 1974 to Canada and been here ever since, carving a life (of sorts) out for me and mine.

I sometimes think I should have knuckled down and stuck it out over there but, hey, I was 21 years old and more interested in partying than I was in keeping my job and so of course I lost the job, my visa was rendered void, basically, and I had little choice but to leave the country and return home. Hindsight is always 20/20 but the German/European way of doing things and the quality of life appealed to me and still does. Is it a perfect way? Of course not, but there are days when I think it is a damn sight better than what is tolerated/permitted here! So, yeah, it's not just UK, believe me!
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Rocky
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 10:21

Stephen, we have a local Tesco (large supermarket chain) Store here, where the car park is practically a race track and double yellow lines have reverted from 'no-parking/waiting' signs to roadside decoration, ignored completely by taxi drivers and anybody else who 'lives by their own rules' (to steal your phrase). It's not just the civvies though. There is a row of parking space outside the store dedicated to disabled drivers and another for 'Mums & Toddlers', both of which are frequently used by soldiers in their early 20's, in uniform and in Army vehicles, too pig ignorant or idle to park farther into the car park and walk that extra 50 or so metres. The last bastion of decency/courtesy has fallen. There's a McDonalds next door to Tesco, where it is not an uncommon sight to see squaddies lob their empty wrappers out of the window of their Landrover/Japanese 4 wheel drive/mini bus, rather than walk the 10 or so metres to the dustbin. I've watched Officers and SNCOs in uniform walk past these clowns and totally ignore them. The trail of rubbish leading from one part of the local area in a virtual straight line to the nearest camp is a disgrace, although one of the RSMs had a few of his troops outside the camp cleaning up last week. As for the conduct of some civvies and the lack of willingness by the authorities to deal with them, it's pointless even going there.

Now all of that may sound like just whingeing, but to be honest whether that's how it is seen or not, I'm not really that bothered. I'm sick to death of those who 'live by their own rules'.
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Teabag
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 11:50

Perhaps a complaint to the camp Rocky? Maybe I am living in the past in hoping that something will be done but you never know.

Whilst I don't condone it, it is worth remembering that any parking restrictions, bays etc in supermarkets or other places such as MacDonalds are not enforceable and mean nothing.

You cannot be fined for using them or overstaying etc. All these private cowboys do is send out enough threatening letters and hope that some people believe their crap about bailiffs, jail or kidnapping your cat. It's all bluff and they never do court because they would lose.

As stated, I don't agree with anyone parking in disabled or mother and baby spaces but that doesn't give these thieves the right to charge extortianate rates to try and control it.

The same applies to Motorway service stations which say that you can park free for two hours and if you go over they send you a stupid bill to your address which DVLA have kindly supplied them for the sum of £2.50 a time. Nice little earner for them as it rakes in millions every year. Despite many complaints DVLA or Government do nothing to stop this, yet how many times are we told to take a rest on motorways if tired?

The best advice anyone can give with any of these things is to ignore them all together. This does not apply to police or councils, just PPC's or Private parking companies. Any doubts then google Pepipoo and look up the facts.
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oldtimer
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 13:10

having read the comments above about disable parking spaces i had a little laugh to myself, although i dont consider my self disabled i am classified as disabled due to a accident which left me with a mobility problem and have a blue badge and disabled road tax allowance.


the problem is that i dont own a car and never have i have always rode a motorbike. the amount of times i have had problems with parking in disabled spaces is unreal,traffic wardens and members of the public who seem to think that you cant be disabled and ride a motorcycle and they dont issue blue badges to motorcycles , even when i produce the blue badge and show my tax disc with disabled on it they still argue that i cant be disabled if i can manage to ride a motorbike, i have had many tickets but have never paid any as when i produce my letter from the MOD stating my disabilty along with evidence from the DVLA it is always scrubbed.

its funny how people think you can drive a car but not a motorbike if you are disabled.

paul.
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brum
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 13:54

Rocky's comments on the modern-day squaddie rang a bell with me.
In this part of Cheshire there is a town which is rather like that exhibition of Victorian life, called Beamish. This town however aims to give you a taste of life in a Third World country. The town is called Crewe.
Today, in the middle of Crewe stands a recruiting stand, manned by the Mercian Regiment. There they loutishly stand stand, dressed in desert combat kit, hands in pockets and scowling aggressively at anyone who comes near.
I dared to ask a question about a sniping rifle they had on show the answer I received was the time-honoured "Yer wot?"
In the sixties such shows of military excellence were given the title KAPE (Keeping the Army in the Public Eye) tours. They really should keep the army OUT of the public eye if that's the best they can muster.
I understand that it must be difficult to keep people in the army these days and that discipline has become a dirty word but this bunch, like Rocky's neighbors, were a disgrace.
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 14:37

I';m with you on that Brum,

We had one here in Sutton and being an old soldier wandered over for a chat, they seemed totally disinterested that I'd served 22 in the RAOC, even though they were RLC.
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Rocky
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 16:11

I follow your point Teabag but frankly I haven't the time nor the want to sit down and draft letters to Bde HQs. It's so commonplace now, you'd be writing a letter a week. It's not an issue of enforceability of parking spaces either, the issue is the ignorance and idleness of the military driver who is also blasé enough to conduct himself in such a manner in the first place and the reluctance of Officers and NCOs to engage them.

The desert combats thing appears to be seen as a 'get out of jail free card' as far as the basic rules of discipline go. If you've been deployed or are just about to be, you can sling the rule book out of the window as far as some units are concerned as it doesn't apply to you. I've served in Afghanistan and not once did I consider myself above the rules either pre or post deployment. I appreciate that there are more important issues to prosecute but basic Garrison discipline should never be set aside. It's the very bedrock of what we are or were as the case may be.

On saying that though, I bumped into a recruiting team at my local University who were professional, polite and keen to have a natter about my service, theirs and that of my 72 year old ex RAF colleague, which was by far the more interesting!

Right I think I've dragged the thread off topic far enough...bratty stands...we need bratty stands!!
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Teabag
Maj Gen
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Teabag

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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 16:29

Bought some bratty crisps yesterday out of curiosity. Crap.
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 16:34

I buy my Bratties at Lidl, they cook up great on the BBQ
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Rocky
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PostSubject: Re: What would?   What would? Icon_minitime2/6/2010, 16:36

Was it those football themed things from Walkers? My eldest (11 yrs) mugged her mum into buying them last weekend to put into her and her little sister's lunch boxes. I ended up eating both packets. You're right...they were crap. Whoever thought that they tasted anything like a bratty had obviously never been to Germay! According to my eldest, the American cheeseburger flavoured ones were the better choice, the English Roast Beef came second but the Mexican Salsa things got binned straight away. Walkers Crisps...talk about cashing in eh?
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