27th Canadian Infantry Brigade

Baor((27CIB) surfers,
Some Further Iconic Symbols from the Canadian Animal Kingdom
A further review of our iconic wild life animals indicates that the following animals should be added along side our beaver and polar bear. However, they are not being added to diminish the significance of the use of the beaver and polar bear in our national symbols.
\
The pictures of the two angry bears are the Grizzly on the left and the Black or Brown bear on the right. The Latin names Ursus Horribilis for the bears are very descriptive.
The Grizzly is found mainly in British Columbia and the Yukon Territory but not in the Arctic. The Black and Brown bears are found from in the West coast and as far East as Quebec but generally not as far south as Southern Ontario or Quebec.

The Bull Moose is regarded as one of Canada's most majestic and widely pictured animals in Canada. The snarling wolf shown could be either a Timber or Grey wolf. There are a couple of other species also worthy of note, the Massasauga Rattlesnake found principally in Ontario in the vicinity of Georgian Bay and the North of Lake Huron and the Elk found in the Western provinces. Even our once shy and reclusive coyote is coming out of the remnants of what are left of the Queen's Bush in Huron and Bruce Counties and becoming more aggressive. Our Canadian sports teams are are using pictures of these animals to promote their games and teams. For example we have the Winnipeg Moose and Sudbury Wolves hockey teams. The sweaters for the Sudbury Wolves are the most sought after collectibles in the Ontario Jr Hockey league. The same promotional PR should be used to support recruiting for our militia regiments.
As the finale of this topic in this forum click on the following hyperlink:
http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&cp=37&gs_id=85&xhr=t&q=This+Land+is+your+land+and+this+land+is+my+land+Canadian+versiom+U+Tube&pf=p&sclient=psy-ab&source=hp&pbx=1&oq=This+Land+is+your+land+and+this+land+is+my+land+Canadian+versiom+U+Tube&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=e2d3beeb13884780&biw=770&bih=320

im prety sure he was in the infantry , he was a private his No. was SD5457 and not sure of the date he was in germany i will have to ask my grandma lol she will know,,,, he was born in 1929 so im guessing it would have to be in the 50's and thanks for the tip Hardrations i also have a few pics of his time in the army i will post them soon

NickGalipeau wrote:

im prety sure he was in the infantry , he was a private his No. was SD5457 and not sure of the date he was in germany i will have to ask my grandma lol she will know,,,, he was born in 1929 so im guessing it would have to be in the 50's and thanks for the tip Hardrations i also have a few pics of his time in the army i will post them soon

So Bob he has a Quebec number. If he was infantry who was the French/Cdn Battalion or Company in 27 Bde? I know he neccesarily would not have to be in a Fr/Cdn out fit, but it would fit.

Nick
Bien venue

Bob Ritter is our resident expert on the Hannover based 27 CIB and will doubtless confirm an earlier posting on the composition of the three Canadian Infantry Battalions when he next drops in

I suspect your grandfather was a member of B Company 1st Canadian Infantry Battalion, a francophone Company formed from the Montreal based Fusiliers Mont Real

Bob Ritter mentioned the Sudbury Wolves hockey team, I saw them play in London when they did a European tour around 1949,even the World Championships maybe,they were rough and tough on the ice and unruly off of it,Max Silverman was their boss,and on their departure were told never to return.
Later when I was in Petawawa they were in the NOHA Snr A League and came to Pembroke to play the Lumber Kings,guess what,no change Max Silverman was still there and they hadn't changed their ways.One game I remember a Yellow and Green sweater catching my eye,it was one of their defencemen, "Moose" Gustafson offof the ice and up near the back having a fight with someone in the crowd. This has nothing to do with 27 Bde but just a memory from my early days in Canada.

But all the same, very interesting Tony

Hardration
Saw your post in regard to Nick's request; I sent a reply to Nick but it was either lost or rejected in the forum. Will try to post again, Sorry
BobR

Tony E
Very surprised to see your post about the Sudbury Wolves Hockey Team. Do you have any idea what the odds are of having someone on the Baor forum on the internet having heard of the Sudbury Wolves as well as having seen them play. Unbelievable. Yes , you got that right, they were a rough, ill disciplined team during that time, much like the city of Sudbury ( a miner's town)during that era. The team has cleaned up their act largely as a result of the discipline being handed down now by David Branch the Commissar for the Ontario Jr A Hockey League. Branch runs a squeaky clean organization. The Wolves had a good season last year but not quite as good this year. The city of Sudbury has really transformed itself from the days of your time in Canada. It was a city with mountains of slag from the mines. The building of the super stack has carried the pollution downwind several miles and it is now a city green with trees and vegetation. Nice to see.
Thanks for your post
BobR.

Baor(27CIB)
Nick, Hardrations, JPW,
You are very fortunate, Nick, to have Hardration and JPW working on your uncle's service in the former Baor(27CIB). Hardration's advice about looking for your Uncle's service records in Ottawa is an excellent idea but before you go that route we should try to pry out some further details from you. JPW is doing research on the 27CIB and his information is a very good start because if Lucien served in B Coy, Ist Canadian Infantry Battalion with Les Fusiliers Mont Royal it reduces the search area from ca 5000+ to ca200+.
Huntington is about 75 miles from Montreal so it is feasible that he may have joined Les Fusiliers Mont Royal Militia Regiment. If this can be verified, it may also open further avenues of research from regimental sources such as unit diaries and nominal roles. However, there was also a second French Canadian Regiment in Montreal at that time called the Victoria Rifles of Canada which also provided a company in the same battalion. I think the first option is the more likely of the two for the initial research. The following information is what is known and what we surmise:
Service No. Rank and name : SD5457 Pte Lucien Galipeau aka 'Spot'
Birthdate: 1929-1997
Date of enlistment as a volunteer and service in the 27CIB ca1951-53
Deployment: Hannover, West Germany most likely at the London Edinburgh Barracks
Are there any records of Canadian service following the 27CIB in 1953
Further info from your grandmother, and your uncle's siblings, brothers, sisters, wife , children
Personal papers such as Enrolment, Discharge papers, letters home
Personal clothing such as a beret with cap badge, tunic with shoulder flashes
Pictures of Lucien in his uniform and I'm sure that JPW will be interested in any pictures you may have of Hannover and district for his research
Did he belong to the Royal Canadian Legion?
Good luck with your homework,
BobR

Nick it might also be mentioned that your grandfather is probably eligible for the Special Service Medal (SSM) NATO. This can be applied for posthumously by your grandmother if it hadn't already been applied for and received . You should be able to get the application papers at any Canadian Legion or Army Navy Club.


SSM (NATO)


To obtain information from a military service file or a statement of military service, contact Library and Archives
Canada at 1-866-578-7777 or write to:

Library and Archives Canada
Personnel Record Unit (PRU)
395 Wellington Street
Ottawa ON K1A 0N3

I might also mention that I believe service records are kept only to the 100th birthday date of all service members who only served in peace time. Only war time records are kept permanetly.

Thanks guy's for all the good info, I asked my grandma and she told me my grand'dad was serving in 1951-53 . lol she told me that he was the boot shiner for his superior . Other than that she dosent know anything else. and for the medal thing that would be great , i will definitely keep serching on the subject and call the Library and Archives . Thank you so much guy's

So she is saying he was an officers orderly. That could cover a lot of territory. Worked for the Platoon Commander, Company Commander, Commanding Officer, Adjutant, who knows.

Baor(27CIB) surfers and bird watchers,
Another iconic image for the list
Earlier a list of Canadian animals was submitted as additions for consideration as symbols which might be used to enhance our PR for sports teams and militia regiments. A recent sighting was made of a very rare bird in Southern Ontario which made the front page of the Kitchener Record newspaper. The following picture is a Great Grey Owl which is native to Northern Ontario, the outer reaches of the Prairie Provinces, and into Alaska.

This magnificent bird has a wingspan of five feet and has been sighted for the last month in the fields near the rural roads of Kingsville, Ontario situated on Lake Erie. ''hundreds of birdwatchers, photographers, locals, and curious out-of-towners , have descended upon the town hoping to catch a glimpse of a bird which has never travelled this far south''.
BobR

Nick, Hardration,
My read on your information is that your grandfather was probably what is known in the infantry as a 'batman' most likely for a Platoon Lieutenant. This was a service in addition to the normal duties of a Pte and for which he received a small allowance and a pass now and then. By itself it does not help us very much in our search for Lucien. Keep working on it.
BobR

Other info i got is that he was bassed in Hanover Germany 51-53. Until i get to contact the Library and Archives i dont know anything else. :'( . and he was in the royal canadian legion. The way i found out he was in the 27th brigade is when i googled his name and in the legion magazine his name poped up.. Last Post: Death Notice
Search again...

Private Lucien GALIPEAU
Date Deceased: October 22, 1997

Age: 68

Service Information
Service Number: SD5457

Units: 27th Brigade

Period of Service: Canadian Forces.

Legion Branch Information
Member Title:

Legion Branch: Huntingdon Branch

Location: Quebec

Baor(27CIB)surfers,
Installment No.23 58th Independent Field Squadron RCE 27CIB 1951-53
PartA
The following sources were used to support the research for this summary:
Historical Section (GS) Army Headquarters, Directorate of History, National Defense Headquarters, Ottawa, Canada, K1A 0K2, Report No.s 51, 82 as well as the summary for the 27CIB on the home page Forum for the Baor drafted by Peter Watson.
Report No 82 p.6, Para 24,'' On 4 May 51 the Minister of National Defense, Mr. Brooke Claxton announced in the House of Commons that to fulfill its obligation, a new formation known as the 27th Canadian infantry brigade group would be recruited''. Report No 51, p.6, para 16 ''designated the following units to form the 58th Independent Field Squadron, RCE:
56th Independent Field Squadron, St. John's Nfdl.
6th Field Engineer Regiment, Winnipeg, Man.
33rd Field Park Squadron, Lethbridge, Alta''
"Para 19, Units of 27 Brigade remained in their recruiting areas until 11 Jun 51 or later''. Subsequently they moved to Petawawa for training. Claxton's plan was that another cohort would remain in Canada and train to provide replacements for the 27th in Germany. In this regard ''to train and administer replacement personnel of the Royal Canadian Engineers and Royal Canadian Electrical and Mechanical Engineers, the following units were formed effective 1 Aug 1951:
59th Independent Field Squadron RCE at Camp Petawawa
No 195 Infantry Workshop RCEME at Barriefield.''
Movement Overseas:
"The largest group was Serial 2 which left Quebec on 12 Nov aboard an Italian ship the M/V 'Fairsea' and docked at Rotterdam on 21 Nov. It included 58 Independent Fd Sqn RCE which paraded with 1st Cdn Inf Bn before General Eisenhower and Mr. Claxton at the Town Sq in Rotterdam.''
para 25,''the squadron was quartered in Hamelin with 26 Field Engineer Regiment, RE. Here on the Weser River, good facilities for engineer training existed, including a wet bridging area. The unit embarked on intensive training which continued until the time for rotation came in 1953.'' The following picture shows the RCE cap badge with the King's crown, GRVI and the engineer moto ''Honi soit qui mal y pense'' meaning ''Shamed be he who thinks evil of it.''

Part b to follow,
BobR

Baor(27CIB) surfers,
Part B to Installment No.23, 58th Independent Field Squadron RCE 27CIB
During the remainder of 1951, Report No 82, P.7, para 26 states the following,''The unit carried
out range practices three times during the year, once at Wolfenbuttel, and twice at Sennelager. In addition, individual training requirements were at courses provided by the R.E. The unit also conducted courses on mine warfare and demolitions for Canadian Infantry units''.
Para 27, "The second year (1952) followed a similar pattern, married men served in Germany for a one-year period, single men for two. Replacement personnel were subjected to similar hard training. For the single men, the second year succeeded in raising individual standards, and emphasized the training lessons of the first year. The monotony of training, however, was broken by one emergency, the interesting account of which follows:
para 28,''In the early morning of Sunday, 1 Feb 53, a northerly gale swept down the North Sea, piling up the shallow sea waters against the West coast of the Netherlands. It was a time of spring tides, and the waters in the estuaries of the Rhine and the Maas were at a particularly high level due to rain and melting snow in their upper reaches. These three circumstances , happening together, overwhelmed the dykes around the Dutch coast. The gale lashed the sea into pounding waves which swept over the dykes, and barns, sheds, even houses, were simply swept away. People were killed in the collapsing houses and others, who temporarily escaped, later died of cold and exposure. Cattle tethered in their stalls were without hope of rescue and drowned.
para 29, ''It was decided that army assistance from Germany could best be rendered by the engineers. 58 Independent Fd Sqn sent one troop by road to work under 38 Corps Engineer Regiment R.E. Equipped with folding boats, small tugs and power floats , the troop was detailed to Middelharnis on the island of Overflakes. Arriving in darkness and a driving snowstorm on the night of 8 Feb, they found that the town was surrounded by water except for the raised dyke-roads. All through the next day dead cattle were recovered. Since there was some risk of typhus , the men wore oilskins and rubber gloves. Work proceeded until 17 Feb., when more than 350 dead cows had been hauled out. The Dutch had not forgotten the liberation of their country by Canadians. On leaving Holland , the troop commander was told,' What you have done has been a very great help, but most of all to see your Canadian trucks arrive here when our morale was so low, meant everything' .''
The 58th Independent Fd Sqn left Germany on 3 Dec 53 for Canada fulfilling their NATO mission.
When King George VI died in 1952, a remake of the RCE cap badge took place with the introduction of the Queen's crown, the iconic beaver symbol, as well as a change from the former motto to "ubigue".
A picture of the new cap badge follows along with a very short musical tribute to the RCE

https://mail.google.com/mail/?tab=wm#sent/134d576ddadaa433

Next installment the RCASC.
BobR

Bob, another super contribution, much appreciated with fleshes out my much earlier notes, very glad your sources confirmed the Canadian Sappers were based in Hameln (there was some conflicting evidence on their exact location).

Very interested in your mention of the RCEME Workshop, are you going to cover this in more detail in a future contribution? Would be interested to know where their personnel were recruited from plus the RCD Squadron , the Gunner Regiment and the Sappers must have had their own dedicated team of specialist RCEME tradesmen, how were they recruited?

JPW
Thanks for your message. yes, I plan to research the following RCEME units which were deployed with the 27CIB according to Historical Report No. 51
Base Unit- No.1 Canadian Base Repair Section RCEME
Battle Units- No 196 Light Aid Detachment RCEME
- No 197 Light Aid Detachment RCEME
Support Unit- No 194 Infantry Workshop RCEME
At the present time I am not able to answer your further questions about the RCEME issues but will pursue this in due course.
I have just finished reviewing J.L. Granatstein's book " Canada's Army, Waging War and Keeping the Peace." I had hoped that the book might answer a few of the issues you raised earlier but was disappointed because it was far too general in scope. There are still a few other books on my bibliography which may help.
Good to hear from you,
BobR

Bob

Thank you, you have answered my question

I think the British REME and RCEME differed very slightly at the time The British firstline REME support units took the title of their parent unit, the Canadians an independent establishment.

Suspect 194 LAD Detachment was in support of the RCD Squadron
197 LAD was with the Gunners

Will be interesting to know where the Base Workshop increment went, could have been either 23 Base Workshop in Wetter, which Stephen Locke has mentioned in the past, or the Hannover based 4 Armoured Workshop

Bob Ritter,I answered your email but the address was rejected,I will try again,but the short answer is that Stonehenge was the correct name not just a nickname according to my friend who was with 55 Tpt Coy.

Tony

Baor(27CIB)surfers,
Installment No. 24 Part A
No 55 Transport Company RCASC, 27CIB 1951-53
No 3 Movement Control Group RCASC, 27CIB 1951-53
No 4 Movement Control Group RCASC, 27CIB 1951-53
The following sources were used to support the research for this summary:
1. Report No. 51, Historical Section (GS) Army Headquarters, Directorate of History National
Defense Headquarters, Ottawa Canada K1A 0K2.
2. RCASC Association www.rcasc.org
3. Report written by Tony Sutton, the "Cold Store'' for the History for the BAOR Forum.
4. ''From Pharmacy to Helicopters'', a history by LCol Jim Grant a former member of
55 Transport Company 27CIB 1951-53.

Historical Report No 51
Page 9, para 24 ''To train and administer replacement personnel of the Royal Canadian Army
Service Corps, the following unit to be formed effective 1 Aug 51:
No 56 Transport Company RCASC at Camp Borden''.
Page 5, Para 16 ''Reserve force units contributing to the 27th Canadian Infantry Brigade:
R.C.A.S.C.- to form No 55 Transport Company and replacements.
Page 9, Para 25 (a) designated as a ''battle unit''
No 55 Transport Company R.C.A.S.C.
Page 10, Para 25 (c) designated as a ''Support unit''
No 3 Movement Control Group, R.C.A.S.C.
No 4 Movement Control Group, R.C.A.S.C.
Page 11, Para 30 '' target dates for the completion of each phase of training were set as
follows:
Basic training completed...............15 Jul 51
Individual training completed.........30 Sep 51
Sub-unit (platoon and company or
equivalent training completed........31 Oct 51
Page13, Para 36 ''Mr. Claxton informed the House of Commons that arrangements had
been made to group the Canadian Brigade with the British, Belgian, and
Netherlands forces and that it would be stationed in the Hannover area.''
Page 14, Para 39 ''Movement to Europe"
''Army headquarters issued on 19 Sep 51 a warning order that 27 Cdn Inf
Bde Gp would move to the British Occupied Zone of Germany and there
come under the command of the British Army of the Rhine. This warning
order advised that there would be no move before 1 Nov, except for
advance parties to be ready in October.''
Page 15, para 41, ''part of No 3 Movement Control Group R.C.A.S.C. was flown over by
aircraft, the balance sailed on the 'Empress of Scotland' on 28 Sep 51. Its
headquarters was established in Whitehall and movement control officers
were located at the hook of Holland, Hannover, and Hamburg.''
Page 15, Para 43, '' The first group to move by sea was a base advance party of 8 officers
and 130 O.R. This group included 50 drivers, R.C.A.S.C. This base
advance party embarked at Quebec on the T.S.S. 'Canberra', a Greek
Line vessel, and sailed on 4 Oct 51 for Hamburg, arriving there on
14 Oct.
Page 15, Para 44, ''The advance party of the Brigade group totaled 35 officers and 293 O.R.
Embarkation took place at both Montreal and Quebec on 20 Oct 51
aboard the S.S.'Columbia', also of the the Greek line. This group sailed
directly to Rotterdam.''
Page 15, Para 45, ''The main body of the Brigade Group sailed to Rotterdam in six serials at
approximately weekly intervals each being about ten days at sea, Serial
Five sailed from Halifax on 8 Dec with 55 Tpt Coy, R.C.A.S.C. and
docked at Rotterdam on 17 Dec.''
55 Tpt Coy RCASC was based at Stonehenge Barracks. There has been some confusion about the exact location of Stonehenge Barracks. According to Tony Sutton in his article ''Cold Store'' in the BAOR Forum history, he stated that 55 Coy was based at Stonehenge Barracks at Langenhagen. This was also reported by LCol James Grant in his article entitled, "From Pharmacy to Helicopters"' in his statement, ''I first served with 55 Tpt Coy in 27Bde at Hannover (Stonehenge barracks).'' The picture which follows at the conclusion of part A to this installment also lists the site as Stonehenge Barracks.

Baor(27CIB) surfers'
Part B Installment No 24, No 55 Transport Company RCASC, 27CIB, 1951-53
What follows is a post script to part A of No 55 Transport Company, which deals with certain events connected with the 27CIB but which took place subsequent to their NATO mission ending in 1953:
The former Langenhagen Base and Stonehenge Barracks were demolished and developed into a residential/commercial area. The site is now owned by Wasserstadt Limmer Gmbh & Co formerly The Continental Rubber Co.
The Former RCASC underwent a sad and painful transition which started in the 1950's terminating on 1 Feb 1968 when the Canadian Forces Reorganization Act was proclaimed and which evolved into the Canadian Forces Logistical Branch. The cap badge of the RCASC on the left had the motto "honi soit qui mal y pense'', but at some point in its history it became "Nil Sine Lahore'' (Nothing Without Work). The RCASC Association has as its motto, " We no longer serve but we live On"'. The Logistics badge compliments of Tony Sutton has the motto 'Servitum Nulli Secundus" (Service Second to None).


Next Installment RCEME
BobR

Baor(27CIB) surfers,
Installment No. 25 No 1 Canadian Base Repair Section RCEME
No 194 Infantry Workshop RCEME
No 196 Light Aid Detachment RCEME
No 197 Light Aid Detachment RCEME
The following sources were used to support the research for this summary:
1. Report No 51, Historical Section (GS) Army Headquarters, Directorate of History National
Defense Headquarters, Ottawa, Canada, K1A 0K2
2. rceme.com/history.htm
Historical Report No. 51
Page 7 ''R.C.E.M.E.-to form No. 194 Infantry Workshop, Nos. 196 and 197 Light Aid
detachments, and replacements. All military Commands, assembled at Barriefield, Ont.''
Page 9, Para 24,''To train and administer replacement personnel of the Royal Canadian Electrical
and Mechanical Engineers, the following units were formed effective 1 Aug 51:
No. 195 Infantry Workshop, R.C.E.M.E., at Barriefield
Page 9, Para 28(a) Designation as a 'Battle unit'
No 196, Light Aid Detachment, R.C.E.M.E.
No 197, Light Aid Detachment R.C.E.M.E.
Page 9, Para 25(b) Designation as a Support Unit'
No. 194 Infantry Workshop, R.C.E.M.E.
Page 10, Para 25(c) Designation as a 'Base Unit'
No.1 Canadian Base Repair Section, R.C.E.M.E.''
Page 15, Para 43 re: Movement to Europe
'' The first group to move by sea was an Advance Party including a port workshops detachment, R.C.E.M.E. This base advance party embarked at Quebec on the T.S.S. 'Canberra', a Greek Line vessel and sailed on 4 Oct 51 for Hamburg, arriving there on 14 Oct. The main body of the brigade sailed in six serials; the last sailed from Halifax on 8 Dec and arrived in Rotterdam on 23 Dec. The following excerpt is taken from the RCEME Association History: ''This included Light Aid Detachments (LAD'S) which could deploy quickly to recover or repair equipment on the line, or in transit to the front. The RCEME triage system was divided into three groups: 1st line, which would be embedded in the operational units, would carry out routine maintenance and minor repairs; 2nd line, which were located in Field Workshops back from the front, carried out major overhauls and full component replacements; 3rd line would be responsible for reconditioning and rebuilding equipment. The structure is still in place today, with 1st line maintenance platoons/troops embedded in combat units, while 2nd line is located 20 minutes to 2 hours away''
It has been difficult to find research which pinpoints the exact location of the RCEME units in the three lines of triage explained above. Peter Watson in a recent post to this forum 19/1/2012 09: 02 stated, ''Suspect 194 LAD was in support of the RCD Squadron and 197 LAD was with the Gunners and the RCEME Base Workshop could have been with either 23 Base Workshop at Wetter or with 4 Armoured Workshop at Hannover.'' As well, Tony Sutton in his article entitled, "Cold Store" which he wrote for the Baor History forum stated,'' At Langenhagen Barracks resided 55 Tpt Coy RCASC and I believe also a RCEME Fd Workshop''
The RCEME Corps Badge 1949 - 1952 and 1952- 68
"This article was taken from the RCEME Association site, '' In 1949, the RCEME Corps adopted a new badge identical to the British one which had been struck in 1947. It consisted of a white horse(a mustang as opposed to the Arabian horse on the British badge) superimposed over a lightning bolt. A chain was fixed around its neck running down its back, standing on a globe, to which the other end of the chain is attached, which pictured the Western hemisphere (whereas the British badge pictured Europe, Africa, Australia, Antarctica and Asia). Behind the horse's head was a scroll with the letters R.C. on one side of the head and E.M.E. on the other, surmounted by the Tudor Crown. The only modification ever made to this badge was in 1952 when Elizabeth 11 ascended the thrown, and the Tudor Crown was replaced with St. Edward's Crown. However, it should be noted that there were many changes made to the Canadian badge during the period 1968 to the present era.


RCEME Motto ''Nil Sine Labore'' ''Nothing without labour''
Next Installment. RCAMC and RCDC

BobR

Baor(27CIB)surfers,
The following post is a short musical video relating to my former post about the 58th Independent Field squadron RCE 27CIB. Hopefully the hyperlink will play out but have not mastered the fine skill of determining what is in the public domain and what is not, but here goes.
C:\Users\Owner\Documents\My Scans\Royal Canadian Engineers.Band htm 1953.htm
BobR