BFG/BAOR/RAFG Locations
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BFG/BAOR/RAFG Locations

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 As it was in the beginning......

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brum
"john boy"
Shelldrake
dandc
cartav
9 posters
AuthorMessage
cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime30/6/2012, 11:15

As it was in the beginning...... Dvr_ha10


Don't know if anyone else remembers this sort of thing, which is copied from a Brit version of the German highway code, BAOR Publication Code No.B54, issued in the 1950's. The lantern hung over a crossroad junction, the white bar moved clockwise to show "Stop" or "Go". As the precise time left before flooring the accelerator pedal could be seen, the start was something akin to a current Grand Prix.

The last para. about giving military vehicles priority was a joke. Any Don R in charge of a column who stuck his bike across a junction to wave his charges through, was in danger of being squashed under an 18 wheel Henschel & trailer.
Only saw them give way when a sqn of Cents was on the move.
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dandc
Lt Col
Lt Col
dandc


Number of posts : 383
Age : 72
Localisation : gateshead
Cap Badge : 15/19H.ARMY AIR CORPS
Places Served : tidworth, fallingbostle, detmold, hongkong, minden
Registration date : 2009-05-22

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime30/6/2012, 12:39

the one in detmold town centre was known to the brits as the swinging tit.
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cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime30/6/2012, 14:55

As it was in the beginning...... German10


Something else pulled out of a long forgotten folder.......... The sort of map printed for use in 1952 from an original WO production of 1944. Scale was 1:100,000, 1 km grid square was 1 cm x 1 cm. I presume these were German maps over-printed with Brit. info. on the Legend data. With all roads in red they could be confusing to anyone used to our own OS sheets which, at 1" to a mile, were somewhat larger and clearer. Contour lines, in brown, are few and far between, but that's the nature of the land. In the main, spot heights in
metres, were more readily assimilated by anyone requiring to find the high ground.

On the ground, except for the autobahns, the postwar German road system was inferior to our own. Even some stretches of what we might think of as "A" roads were only surfaced on one half, the other being compacted earth. The tarmac could be on either side, was steeply cambered and varied sides from place to place. Normally traffic would travel on the surfaced stretches. If these were on the right, oncoming traffic had to give way. Roads in smaller built up areas were totally unsurfaced.

In the main, road signs were similar to those adopted later in UK. One variation was that the start of a built up area (ie a village etc.) had the name in black on yellow, the reverse side marked the exit and the end of inhabited stretch.
The occupying armies had free range and authority to stop anywhere and take over anything when on exercise. Clever villagers were known to reverse the signs to confuse unwelcome visitors.
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Shelldrake
FM
FM
Shelldrake


Number of posts : 3048
Localisation : Camberley
Cap Badge : Royal Artillery
Places Served : Troon, Lippstadt, Devizes, NI, Paderborn, Dortmund, Colchester, Belize, Canada, Cyprus, Gutersloh
Registration date : 2010-10-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime30/6/2012, 15:51

That would probably account for the name of the village "Rimsting" in Bavaria, David? pale
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"john boy"
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
As it was in the beginning...... 890-95


Number of posts : 939
Age : 60
Localisation : shrewsbury
Cap Badge : acc
Places Served : aldershot/albermarle bks ouston-father LI- gib- berlin NI- lemgo- colchester- shrewsbury-tidworth left82
Registration date : 2010-12-30

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime30/6/2012, 17:08

As it was in the beginning...... 178069004641c17fa7eea619a644

Might as well join in just a few sign to have a gander at
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brum
FM
FM



Number of posts : 2808
Age : 82
Localisation : Sandbach Cheshire
Cap Badge : RA/QOH
Places Served : JLRRA (Hereford) Nienburg Paderborn Colchester Munster Maresfield (Cyprus) Hohne Hemer Op Banner x4 Woolwich
Registration date : 2010-03-02

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime30/6/2012, 18:25

Shelldrake wrote:
That would probably account for the name of the village "Rimsting" in Bavaria, David? pale

"Rimsting" ?

I thought that was caused by over-indulgence in super hot curry ! affraid
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pete26
Capt
Capt



Number of posts : 209
Cap Badge : R.E.
Places Served : Farnborough, Hohne, Ulster, Berchtesgaden,Chatham..
Registration date : 2012-04-29

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime30/6/2012, 18:44

Talking of older signs.

I never got round the signs that said 'No British servicemen' in places like Celle in the early 1970s.

So we used to get one of our cloggie mates to take us in, then pretend we were Dutch if anyone asked !
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cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime1/7/2012, 09:51

brum wrote:
Shelldrake wrote:
That would probably account for the name of the village "Rimsting" in Bavaria, David? pale

"Rimsting" ?
I thought that was caused by over-indulgence in super hot curry ! affraid


There's me, digging into recesses of memory, trying to be serious (for once!), wallowing in nostalgia, and you're all tempting with chances to return to normality........

1. Dunno, Shelldrake, but if that sign was turned round it would be "Gnitsmir"
wouldn't it ?
2. I recall, Brum, that a mixture of Sauerkraut & Becks had a similar effect.
The Fraulein & her sister said nothing at the time, just sat there giggling,
waiting for the anticipated disturbance to my system. They were not
disappointed.

Back to" The Beginning", signs etc................ I think I may have brought this up previously, but it's relevant. Somewhere west of Munster, south of Osnabruck, there's a signed crossroads. It was SOP to stop there when possible to give new lads chance for a photoshoot.

One finger points to FUCHTORF, the other to HARSEWINKEL.
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cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime4/7/2012, 17:27

As it was in the beginning...... 32_bty13

Minden Battery ........... Christmas 1954


32 (Minden) Bty were part of 16 LAA Regt RA, based in Quebec Bks, Osnabruck, in the 1950's. The bty comprised a BHQ tp and two gun tps. each of which were armed with six L60 40mm Bristol Bofors guns. There were approximately 150- 160 men on the bty's peace-time roster, another gun troop would be added if there was a need to expand to wartime establishment. The group on the photograph is broken down as follows :-

8 officers ( 4 Reg 4 NS)
14 SNCOs ( all Reg )
125 ORs. ( about 10% Reg., remainder NS)

Most of the Reg ORs were on a three year engagement, which they opted for when being conscripted, generally to take advantage of the additional pay which was double that of their NS comrades. Few were married, but a three year man didn't rate a married quarter and their wives remained behind in UK.

It is widely known that the NS soldier was preoccupied with demob., the return home at the end of his period with the colours. Every fourteen days another lucky few packed their kit bags for the last time and were shipped out. And this being so, every fourteen days, a batch of replacements, fresh from basic & technical training of about 12 weeks, took the places of those heading back to UK. All this had disturbing effect on some of the 3-year Regs, and few extended their service when the time to stay or leave came up. However, for those that deserved it, it did mean that promotion could come more quickly. Without the core of reg. SNCOs, who, without exception,had WW2 experience, a unit based on these lines could have been less than effective if a shooting war had ever come about.
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cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime4/7/2012, 17:48

As it was in the beginning...... Demob_14

Parting is Such Sweet Sorrow !


Typical National Service demob gathering............ Group 53. 19 saying a joyful farewell to Quebec Barracks with mates who were staying pretending they were enjoying it before going back to cross one more day off the Demob Calendar on the back of the locker door.

53.19 Group was the 19th fortnightly intake of 1953. Up until the Korean War, the NS commitment was for 18 months, but this period was extended to 2 years. Pity those who had banked on an early release, onlyto find they had another six months to do ! As compensation, that last half year was paid at Regular rates, twice those of NS pay.


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ciphers
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
ciphers


Number of posts : 978
Age : 89
Localisation : Abbotsford, British Columbia, Canada V2S 7C5
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Catterick (1951) - BAOR (1952 -1954)-(Herford - Bunde - Munster) - Japan (Kure) - Korea (Pusan - Seoul) - Cyprus (Nicosia) - Suez Op (1st Guards Brigade) - UK (63 Sigs Regt TA, Southampton)
Registration date : 2008-06-30

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime4/7/2012, 21:11

Ahhh.. 6 Armoured Div - finally some recognition

Len (Ciphers)
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http://lenpayne.com/Len_Payne/Jim_Chapman.html
cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime4/7/2012, 21:44

ciphers wrote:
Ahhh.. 6 Armoured Div - finally some recognition

Len (Ciphers)

Eh up Len ! Thought I was all alone here......... there's been one or two but they didn't hang around for long. What was your 20 ? Come on ! Errrr........ better forget the CB & revert to mil. ....... Send your location 6 Armd. Over
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ciphers
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
ciphers


Number of posts : 978
Age : 89
Localisation : Abbotsford, British Columbia, Canada V2S 7C5
Cap Badge : Royal Signals
Places Served : Catterick (1951) - BAOR (1952 -1954)-(Herford - Bunde - Munster) - Japan (Kure) - Korea (Pusan - Seoul) - Cyprus (Nicosia) - Suez Op (1st Guards Brigade) - UK (63 Sigs Regt TA, Southampton)
Registration date : 2008-06-30

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime4/7/2012, 21:53

W Troop, 4 Squadron (20 Armoured Bde Signals Sqn), 6 Armoured Division, first at Wentworth Barracks Herford (1952), then Birdwood, Bunde (1952) then Munster York Barracks (Gremmendorf Kaserne) (1952/54.

Photobucket

I'm 'nasty nuts' Cpl front row seated, right hand.

Len (Ciphers)
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http://lenpayne.com/Len_Payne/Jim_Chapman.html
cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime5/7/2012, 17:43

Nice & aggressive pose there Len ! I see one or two at the very front are wearing elastics .....Hope you gripped 'em after the photoshoot. And I'm reminded that the Krauts used to
sneer "Boy Soldiers !" at us and wonder how they had lost............. Looking at some of your lads on the back row, I can see why! Good job we had those on your row to scare the Ivans !

David
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jim
Let Gen
Let Gen
jim


Number of posts : 1291
Localisation : Sutton Coldfield
Cap Badge : RAOC
Places Served : Dad, Hamburg, Bad Oeynhausen, Iserlohn, Bury, Osnabruck, Worcester. Me Detmold, Bielefeld, NI, HK
Registration date : 2008-01-03

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime6/7/2012, 10:24

I remember the "Swinging Tit" in Detmold, it was still there in the mid '70's.

Nice photo of Quebec Bks as well, The LF's were there in the late '50's. I remember it well.

When did 20 Bde move to Detmold? any one know.
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cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime6/7/2012, 13:33

[quote="jim"] Nice photo of Quebec Bks as well, The LF's were there in the late '50's. I remember it well.


[As it was in the beginning...... Brum230/quote]

Thanks Jim ! LF must have followed us in. 16 LAA RA moved out to Bulford in April '56 to form part of rapid reaction force. Some left before that to make up a movement light unit bound for Cyprus & Eoka. Next time I saw any of the remainder was on a TV newsreel from Suez.

Here 's another from inside Block 9 at Quebec Bks.......... No more than four beds to a room, JNCO's in twos. Note hospital corners & bed being used for proper purpose instead of just forming a display area in trg. for trinkets listed on the 1157.

Must be dark winter, probably a Wednesday when occupants have run out of readies and have chosen to stay in. "Ginger" is reading, probably a well thumbed Hank Jansen, Eric is writing to a loved one back in UK. Only bit of non-military kit on display is the radio on which it was SOP to tune into Two Way Family Favourites on a Sunday, when Cliffe Michelmore and Jean Metcalfe hosted BBC from Hamburg & London.

Behind each bed, below a shelf carrying blancoed '37 issue small pack and steel helmet, hangs the greatcoat with sharp pleats ironed in the front skirt. Never used except for winter Guard Mounting.
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Stephen Lock
Maj Gen
Maj Gen
Stephen Lock


Number of posts : 937
Age : 69
Localisation : Calgary
Cap Badge : Pads Brat
Places Served : Father -- Canadian Army. Served Hemer, Soest, and Wetter
Registration date : 2007-12-28

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime7/7/2012, 18:42

Speaking of signs....

Got a picture...or had one...of my Very Proper Genteel English Nana from when she and Papa (maternal grandparents) visited us in Germany standing in front of a sign "Ausfahrt". Not at all what I grew up thinking was her sense of humour! Like many of her generation, she styled herself after the Queen Mum and was always soft spoken and polite and...well....genteel.

Another story -- and people swear it's true! -- was of a young Canadian Army wife recently arrived in Germany. She had occasion to deal with some civilian German authority on some matter. She was rather proud of her grasp of the language...a rudimentary grasp but a grasp...and when asked her address confidently announced she lived at #7 Einbahnstrasse!

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cartav
Maj Gen
Maj Gen



Number of posts : 784
Age : 92
Localisation : s. yorks
Cap Badge : RA (ns) RA, R.Sigs, RE ( TAVR)
Places Served : Oswestry, Tonfanau, Woolwich, Osnabruck, MT School Bordon, Bulford, Manorbier, Hameln, R.Sigs Blandford, RSME Chattenden, Western Highlands.
Registration date : 2011-04-26

As it was in the beginning...... Empty
PostSubject: Re: As it was in the beginning......   As it was in the beginning...... Icon_minitime9/7/2012, 11:47

As it was in the beginning...... Akc_0013

Back to Serious !

Something I received some time back from Tony Burgess who was NS in Osnabruck in the early 1950's. Much different when I got there some years later. The locals were less wary of the Brits and if not quite arrogant they were indifferent to a smile or an apology for some minor indiscretion. It could be quite scary to wander,by mistake, into a Kneiper where squaddies weren't welcome. Certainly we paid full whack on the trolleys back to camp, and it soon became obvious that it wasn't in the German nature to offer a seat to a woman overladen with shopping. Maybe that, but any indication of gratitude to a Brit who stood up wasn't forthcoming . Advantage of the squaddy's good manners was never taken, we remained seated after early rejection. We did come across seats on transport reserved "fur Gebehinderte" for the first time, something which has only been adopted over here more recently. And blackmarket ? No chance !

When half a dozen of us went back on a nostalgia trip about ten years ago we
couldn't find the AKC & town NAAFI. What we thought was the old entrance off street was shut tight. Grafitti all around seemed to show it had been taken over by local teenagers & closed down.
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